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Finalized designs of the Imperial Russian Navy.

Final Tumblehome BB1, Russia Battleship laid down 1895

Displacement:
   12,570 t light; 13,157 t standard; 14,643 t normal; 15,833 t full load

Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep)
   (392.00 ft / 384.00 ft) x 74.00 ft (Bulges 80.00 ft) x (26.25 / 28.19 ft)
   (119.48 m / 117.04 m) x 22.56 m (Bulges 24.38 m)  x (8.00 / 8.59 m)

Armament:
      4 - 12.00" / 305 mm 35.0 cal guns - 749.99lbs / 340.19kg shells, 60 per gun
     Breech loading guns in turret on barbette mounts, 1895 Model
     2 x Twin mounts on centreline ends, evenly spread
      8 - 8.00" / 203 mm 45.0 cal guns - 250.00lbs / 113.40kg shells, 60 per gun
     Breech loading guns in turret on barbette mounts, 1895 Model
     4 x Twin mounts on sides, evenly spread
      12 - 6.00" / 152 mm 45.0 cal guns - 89.99lbs / 40.82kg shells, 180 per gun
     Breech loading guns in casemate mounts, 1895 Model
     12 x Single mounts on centreline ends, evenly spread
      12 hull mounts in casemates- Limited use in heavy seas
      8 - 3.00" / 76.2 mm 50.0 cal guns - 11.99lbs / 5.44kg shells, 360 per gun
     Breech loading guns in deck mounts, 1895 Model
     8 x Single mounts on centreline ends, evenly spread
      8 raised mounts
      Weight of broadside 6,176 lbs / 2,801 kg

Armour:
   - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   14.0" / 356 mm   250.00 ft / 76.20 m   13.86 ft / 4.22 m
   Ends:   6.00" / 152 mm   134.00 ft / 40.84 m   13.86 ft / 4.22 m
   Upper:   6.00" / 152 mm   250.00 ft / 76.20 m   8.00 ft / 2.44 m
     Main Belt covers 100 % of normal length
     Main Belt inclined -30.00 degrees (positive = in)

   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   14.0" / 356 mm   6.00" / 152 mm      12.0" / 305 mm
   2nd:   6.00" / 152 mm   3.00" / 76 mm      6.00" / 152 mm
   3rd:   3.00" / 76 mm         -               -
   4th:   1.00" / 25 mm         -               -

   - Armoured deck - single deck:
   For and Aft decks: 2.00" / 51 mm
   Forecastle: 2.00" / 51 mm  Quarter deck: 2.00" / 51 mm

   - Conning towers: Forward 12.00" / 305 mm, Aft 12.00" / 305 mm

Machinery:
   Coal fired boilers, complex reciprocating steam engines,
   Direct drive, 2 shafts, 11,760 ihp / 8,773 Kw = 17.00 kts
   Range 8,000nm at 10.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 2,676 tons (100% coal)

Complement:
   665 - 865

Cost:
   £1.216 million / $4.864 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 1,127 tons, 7.7 %
      - Guns: 1,127 tons, 7.7 %
   Armour: 5,453 tons, 37.2 %
      - Belts: 3,157 tons, 21.6 %
      - Armament: 1,185 tons, 8.1 %
      - Armour Deck: 801 tons, 5.5 %
      - Conning Towers: 309 tons, 2.1 %
   Machinery: 1,993 tons, 13.6 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 3,977 tons, 27.2 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 2,073 tons, 14.2 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 20 tons, 0.1 %
      - Hull below water: 20 tons

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     19,164 lbs / 8,692 Kg = 22.2 x 12.0 " / 305 mm shells or 2.6 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.40
   Metacentric height 5.8 ft / 1.8 m
   Roll period: 14.0 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 71 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.38
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1.62

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has a flush deck,
     a ram bow and a cruiser stern
   Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0.636 / 0.640
   Length to Beam Ratio: 4.80 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 19.60 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 49 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 44
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): -10.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
   Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length):
            Fore end,    Aft end
      - Forecastle:   20.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Forward deck:   30.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Aft deck:   35.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Quarter deck:   15.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Average freeboard:      16.00 ft / 4.88 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 75.4 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 98.4 %
   Waterplane Area: 21,481 Square feet or 1,996 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 103 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 144 lbs/sq ft or 701 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.90
      - Longitudinal: 2.44
      - Overall: 1.00
   Excellent machinery, storage, compartmentation space
   Adequate accommodation and workspace room
   Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
   Excellent seaboat, comfortable, can fire her guns in the heaviest weather

Tumblehome hull.

Belt and end armor belts cover 12 feet vertically. Belt armor is equivalent to 16.17 inches of vertical armor, end armor is equivalent to 6.93 inches of vertical armor.

Miscellaneous weight:
20 tons hull below water is for 6 x 18 inch torpedo tubes (2 fore, 2 aft, 1 each broadside) with 3 x 1,250 pound torpedoes each.

Final Tumblehome BB2, Russia Battleship laid down 1899

Displacement:
   12,570 t light; 13,180 t standard; 14,566 t normal; 15,674 t full load

Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep)
   (392.00 ft / 384.00 ft) x 74.00 ft (Bulges 80.00 ft) x (26.25 / 28.06 ft)
   (119.48 m / 117.04 m) x 22.56 m (Bulges 24.38 m)  x (8.00 / 8.55 m)

Armament:
      4 - 12.00" / 305 mm 35.0 cal guns - 749.99lbs / 340.19kg shells, 60 per gun
     Breech loading guns in turret on barbette mounts, 1899 Model
     2 x Twin mounts on centreline ends, evenly spread
      4 - 8.00" / 203 mm 45.0 cal guns - 250.00lbs / 113.40kg shells, 60 per gun
     Breech loading guns in deck and hoist mounts, 1899 Model
     2 x Twin mounts on centreline ends, evenly spread
      8 - 8.00" / 203 mm 45.0 cal guns - 250.00lbs / 113.40kg shells, 60 per gun
     Breech loading guns in turret on barbette mounts, 1899 Model
     4 x Twin mounts on sides, evenly spread
      12 - 8.00" / 203 mm 45.0 cal guns - 250.00lbs / 113.40kg shells, 60 per gun
     Breech loading guns in casemate mounts, 1899 Model
     12 x Single mounts on sides, evenly spread
      12 hull mounts in casemates- Limited use in heavy seas
      8 - 3.00" / 76.2 mm 50.0 cal guns - 11.99lbs / 5.44kg shells, 360 per gun
     Breech loading guns in deck mounts, 1899 Model
     8 x Single mounts on centreline ends, evenly spread
      8 raised mounts
      Weight of broadside 9,096 lbs / 4,126 kg

Armour:
   - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   12.0" / 305 mm   250.00 ft / 76.20 m   13.86 ft / 4.22 m
   Ends:   5.00" / 127 mm   134.00 ft / 40.84 m   13.86 ft / 4.22 m
   Upper:   5.00" / 127 mm   250.00 ft / 76.20 m   8.00 ft / 2.44 m
     Main Belt covers 100 % of normal length
     Main Belt inclined -30.00 degrees (positive = in)

   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   12.0" / 305 mm   5.00" / 127 mm      10.0" / 254 mm
   2nd:   6.00" / 152 mm   3.00" / 76 mm            -
   3rd:   6.00" / 152 mm   3.00" / 76 mm      6.00" / 152 mm
   4th:   3.00" / 76 mm         -               -
   5th:   1.00" / 25 mm         -               -

   - Armoured deck - single deck:
   For and Aft decks: 2.00" / 51 mm
   Forecastle: 2.00" / 51 mm  Quarter deck: 2.00" / 51 mm

   - Conning towers: Forward 10.00" / 254 mm, Aft 10.00" / 254 mm

Machinery:
   Coal fired boilers, complex reciprocating steam engines,
   Direct drive, 2 shafts, 13,660 ihp / 10,190 Kw = 17.68 kts
   Range 8,000nm at 10.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 2,494 tons (100% coal)

Complement:
   662 - 861

Cost:
   £1.421 million / $5.684 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 1,599 tons, 11.0 %
      - Guns: 1,599 tons, 11.0 %
   Armour: 4,893 tons, 33.6 %
      - Belts: 2,682 tons, 18.4 %
      - Armament: 1,155 tons, 7.9 %
      - Armour Deck: 799 tons, 5.5 %
      - Conning Towers: 257 tons, 1.8 %
   Machinery: 2,168 tons, 14.9 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 3,890 tons, 26.7 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 1,996 tons, 13.7 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 20 tons, 0.1 %
      - Hull below water: 20 tons

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     15,858 lbs / 7,193 Kg = 18.4 x 12.0 " / 305 mm shells or 2.1 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.38
   Metacentric height 5.6 ft / 1.7 m
   Roll period: 14.2 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 75 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.54
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1.49

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has a flush deck,
     a ram bow and a cruiser stern
   Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0.632 / 0.636
   Length to Beam Ratio: 4.80 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 19.60 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 51 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 50
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): -10.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
   Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length):
            Fore end,    Aft end
      - Forecastle:   20.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Forward deck:   30.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Aft deck:   35.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Quarter deck:   15.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Average freeboard:      16.00 ft / 4.88 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 89.8 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 98.6 %
   Waterplane Area: 21,415 Square feet or 1,989 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 93 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 149 lbs/sq ft or 729 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.89
      - Longitudinal: 2.64
      - Overall: 1.00
   Adequate machinery, storage, compartmentation space
   Adequate accommodation and workspace room
   Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
   Good seaboat, rides out heavy weather easily

Tumblehome hull.

Belt and end armor belts cover 12 feet vertically. Belt armor is equivalent to 16.17 inches of vertical armor, end armor is equivalent to 6.93 inches of vertical armor.

Raised secondary mount is similar to stacked mount on the Kearsarge/Connecticut class battleships.

Miscellaneous weight:
20 tons hull below water is for 6 x 18 inch torpedo tubes (2 fore, 2 aft, 1 each broadside) with 3 x 1,250 pound torpedoes each.

Final Tumblehome 2nd Class BB1, Russia Battleship laid down 1895

Displacement:
   7,000 t light; 7,315 t standard; 7,855 t normal; 8,287 t full load

Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep)
   (300.00 ft / 292.00 ft) x 72.00 ft (Bulges 78.00 ft) x (20.00 / 20.98 ft)
   (91.44 m / 89.00 m) x 21.95 m (Bulges 23.77 m)  x (6.10 / 6.39 m)

Armament:
      4 - 10.00" / 254 mm 45.0 cal guns - 500.01lbs / 226.80kg shells, 60 per gun
     Breech loading guns in turret on barbette mounts, 1895 Model
     2 x Twin mounts on centreline ends, evenly spread
      8 - 6.00" / 152 mm 45.0 cal guns - 89.99lbs / 40.82kg shells, 180 per gun
     Breech loading guns in casemate mounts, 1895 Model
     8 x Single mounts on sides, evenly spread
      8 - 3.00" / 76.2 mm 50.0 cal guns - 11.99lbs / 5.44kg shells, 360 per gun
     Breech loading guns in deck mounts, 1895 Model
     8 x Single mounts on centreline ends, evenly spread
      8 raised mounts
      Weight of broadside 2,816 lbs / 1,277 kg

Armour:
   - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   12.0" / 305 mm   190.00 ft / 57.91 m   13.86 ft / 4.22 m
   Ends:   5.00" / 127 mm   102.00 ft / 31.09 m   13.86 ft / 4.22 m
   Upper:   5.00" / 127 mm   190.00 ft / 57.91 m   8.00 ft / 2.44 m
     Main Belt covers 100 % of normal length
     Main Belt inclined -30.00 degrees (positive = in)

   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   12.0" / 305 mm   5.00" / 127 mm      10.0" / 254 mm
   2nd:   3.00" / 76 mm         -               -
   3rd:   1.00" / 25 mm         -               -

   - Armoured deck - single deck:
   For and Aft decks: 2.00" / 51 mm
   Forecastle: 2.00" / 51 mm  Quarter deck: 2.00" / 51 mm

   - Conning towers: Forward 10.00" / 254 mm, Aft 10.00" / 254 mm

Machinery:
   Coal fired boilers, complex reciprocating steam engines,
   Direct drive, 2 shafts, 5,750 ihp / 4,290 Kw = 15.13 kts
   Range 4,000nm at 10.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 972 tons (100% coal)

Complement:
   416 - 542

Cost:
   £0.618 million / $2.470 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 599 tons, 7.6 %
      - Guns: 599 tons, 7.6 %
   Armour: 3,313 tons, 42.2 %
      - Belts: 2,121 tons, 27.0 %
      - Armament: 446 tons, 5.7 %
      - Armour Deck: 575 tons, 7.3 %
      - Conning Towers: 170 tons, 2.2 %
   Machinery: 975 tons, 12.4 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 2,094 tons, 26.7 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 855 tons, 10.9 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 20 tons, 0.3 %
      - Hull below water: 20 tons

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     12,028 lbs / 5,456 Kg = 24.1 x 10.0 " / 254 mm shells or 2.5 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.58
   Metacentric height 6.6 ft / 2.0 m
   Roll period: 12.8 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 75 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.16
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1.36

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has a flush deck,
     a ram bow and a cruiser stern
   Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0.604 / 0.607
   Length to Beam Ratio: 3.74 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 17.09 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 51 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 55
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): -10.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
   Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length):
            Fore end,    Aft end
      - Forecastle:   20.00 %,  12.00 ft / 3.66 m,  12.00 ft / 3.66 m
      - Forward deck:   30.00 %,  12.00 ft / 3.66 m,  12.00 ft / 3.66 m
      - Aft deck:   35.00 %,  12.00 ft / 3.66 m,  12.00 ft / 3.66 m
      - Quarter deck:   15.00 %,  12.00 ft / 3.66 m,  12.00 ft / 3.66 m
      - Average freeboard:      12.00 ft / 3.66 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 68.5 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 84.8 %
   Waterplane Area: 15,427 Square feet or 1,433 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 104 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 117 lbs/sq ft or 572 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.90
      - Longitudinal: 2.47
      - Overall: 1.00
   Excellent machinery, storage, compartmentation space
   Cramped accommodation and workspace room
   Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
   Good seaboat, rides out heavy weather easily

Tumblehome hull.

Belt and end armor belts cover 12 feet vertically. Belt armor is equivalent to 13.86 inches of vertical armor, end armor is equivalent to 5.77 inches of vertical armor.

Miscellaneous weight:
20 tons hull below water is for 6 x 18 inch torpedo tubes (2 fore, 2 aft, 1 each broadside) with 3 x 1,250 pound torpedoes each.

Final Tumblehome AC1, Russia Armored Cruiser laid down 1895

Displacement:
   7,700 t light; 8,055 t standard; 9,194 t normal; 10,105 t full load

Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep)
   (448.00 ft / 440.00 ft) x 52.00 ft (Bulges 58.00 ft) x (24.00 / 26.04 ft)
   (136.55 m / 134.11 m) x 15.85 m (Bulges 17.68 m)  x (7.32 / 7.94 m)

Armament:
      4 - 8.00" / 203 mm 45.0 cal guns - 250.00lbs / 113.40kg shells, 80 per gun
     Breech loading guns in turret on barbette mounts, 1895 Model
     2 x Twin mounts on centreline ends, evenly spread
      12 - 6.00" / 152 mm 45.0 cal guns - 89.99lbs / 40.82kg shells, 180 per gun
     Breech loading guns in casemate mounts, 1895 Model
     12 x Single mounts on sides, evenly spread
      8 - 3.00" / 76.2 mm 50.0 cal guns - 11.99lbs / 5.44kg shells, 360 per gun
     Breech loading guns in deck mounts, 1895 Model
     8 x Single mounts on centreline ends, evenly spread
      8 raised mounts
      Weight of broadside 2,176 lbs / 987 kg

Armour:
   - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   6.00" / 152 mm   302.00 ft / 92.05 m   13.86 ft / 4.22 m
   Ends:   3.00" / 76 mm   138.00 ft / 42.06 m   13.86 ft / 4.22 m
   Upper:   3.00" / 76 mm   302.00 ft / 92.05 m   8.00 ft / 2.44 m
     Main Belt covers 106 % of normal length
     Main Belt inclined -30.00 degrees (positive = in)

   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   6.00" / 152 mm   3.00" / 76 mm      6.00" / 152 mm
   2nd:   2.00" / 51 mm         -               -
   3rd:   1.00" / 25 mm         -               -

   - Armoured deck - single deck:
   For and Aft decks: 1.00" / 25 mm
   Forecastle: 1.00" / 25 mm  Quarter deck: 1.00" / 25 mm

   - Conning towers: Forward 8.00" / 203 mm, Aft 8.00" / 203 mm

Machinery:
   Coal fired boilers, complex reciprocating steam engines,
   Direct drive, 2 shafts, 14,600 ihp / 10,892 Kw = 19.99 kts
   Range 8,000nm at 10.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 2,050 tons (100% coal)

Complement:
   469 - 610

Cost:
   £0.781 million / $3.124 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 448 tons, 4.9 %
      - Guns: 448 tons, 4.9 %
   Armour: 2,267 tons, 24.7 %
      - Belts: 1,548 tons, 16.8 %
      - Armament: 276 tons, 3.0 %
      - Armour Deck: 291 tons, 3.2 %
      - Conning Towers: 151 tons, 1.6 %
   Machinery: 2,475 tons, 26.9 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 2,491 tons, 27.1 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 1,495 tons, 16.3 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 20 tons, 0.2 %
      - Hull below water: 20 tons

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     8,595 lbs / 3,899 Kg = 33.6 x 8.0 " / 203 mm shells or 1.3 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.35
   Metacentric height 3.2 ft / 1.0 m
   Roll period: 13.7 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 76 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.39
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1.72

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has a flush deck,
     a ram bow and a cruiser stern
   Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0.525 / 0.532
   Length to Beam Ratio: 7.59 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 20.98 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 44 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 44
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): -10.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
   Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length):
            Fore end,    Aft end
      - Forecastle:   20.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Forward deck:   30.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Aft deck:   35.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Quarter deck:   15.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Average freeboard:      16.00 ft / 4.88 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 104.8 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 101.4 %
   Waterplane Area: 15,605 Square feet or 1,450 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 104 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 101 lbs/sq ft or 491 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.93
      - Longitudinal: 1.75
      - Overall: 1.00
   Adequate machinery, storage, compartmentation space
   Adequate accommodation and workspace room
   Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
   Excellent seaboat, comfortable, can fire her guns in the heaviest weather

Tumblehome hull.

Belt and end armor belts cover 12 feet vertically. Belt armor is equivalent to 6.93 inches of vertical armor, end armor is equivalent to 3.46 inches of vertical armor.

Miscellaneous weight:
20 tons hull below water is for 6 x 18 inch torpedo tubes (2 fore, 2 aft, 1 each broadside) with 3 x 1,250 pound torpedoes each.

Final Tumblehome AC2, Russia Armored Cruiser laid down 1897

Displacement:
   9,600 t light; 10,042 t standard; 11,285 t normal; 12,280 t full load

Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep)
   (458.00 ft / 450.00 ft) x 54.00 ft (Bulges 60.00 ft) x (24.00 / 25.94 ft)
   (139.60 m / 137.16 m) x 16.46 m (Bulges 18.29 m)  x (7.32 / 7.91 m)

Armament:
      4 - 10.00" / 254 mm 45.0 cal guns - 500.01lbs / 226.80kg shells, 80 per gun
     Breech loading guns in turret on barbette mounts, 1897 Model
     2 x Twin mounts on centreline ends, evenly spread
      12 - 6.00" / 152 mm 45.0 cal guns - 89.99lbs / 40.82kg shells, 180 per gun
     Breech loading guns in casemate mounts, 1897 Model
     12 x Single mounts on sides, evenly spread
      8 - 3.00" / 76.2 mm 50.0 cal guns - 11.99lbs / 5.44kg shells, 360 per gun
     Breech loading guns in deck mounts, 1897 Model
     8 x Single mounts on centreline ends, evenly spread
      8 raised mounts
      Weight of broadside 3,176 lbs / 1,441 kg

Armour:
   - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   8.00" / 203 mm   296.00 ft / 90.22 m   13.86 ft / 4.22 m
   Ends:   4.00" / 102 mm   154.00 ft / 46.94 m   13.86 ft / 4.22 m
   Upper:   4.00" / 102 mm   296.00 ft / 90.22 m   8.00 ft / 2.44 m
     Main Belt covers 101 % of normal length
     Main Belt inclined -30.00 degrees (positive = in)

   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   8.00" / 203 mm   4.00" / 102 mm      8.00" / 203 mm
   2nd:   3.00" / 76 mm         -               -
   3rd:   1.00" / 25 mm         -               -

   - Armoured deck - single deck:
   For and Aft decks: 1.50" / 38 mm
   Forecastle: 1.50" / 38 mm  Quarter deck: 1.50" / 38 mm

   - Conning towers: Forward 10.00" / 254 mm, Aft 10.00" / 254 mm

Machinery:
   Coal fired boilers, complex reciprocating steam engines,
   Direct drive, 2 shafts, 16,840 ihp / 12,563 Kw = 19.98 kts
   Range 8,000nm at 10.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 2,238 tons (100% coal)

Complement:
   546 - 711

Cost:
   £0.979 million / $3.917 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 664 tons, 5.9 %
      - Guns: 664 tons, 5.9 %
   Armour: 3,262 tons, 28.9 %
      - Belts: 2,093 tons, 18.5 %
      - Armament: 451 tons, 4.0 %
      - Armour Deck: 502 tons, 4.4 %
      - Conning Towers: 217 tons, 1.9 %
   Machinery: 2,761 tons, 24.5 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 2,893 tons, 25.6 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 1,685 tons, 14.9 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 20 tons, 0.2 %
      - Hull below water: 20 tons

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     10,682 lbs / 4,845 Kg = 21.4 x 10.0 " / 254 mm shells or 1.5 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.25
   Metacentric height 3.0 ft / 0.9 m
   Roll period: 14.6 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 75 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.55
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1.55

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has a flush deck,
     a ram bow and a cruiser stern
   Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0.610 / 0.614
   Length to Beam Ratio: 7.50 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 21.21 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 46 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 48
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): -10.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
   Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length):
            Fore end,    Aft end
      - Forecastle:   20.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Forward deck:   30.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Aft deck:   35.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Quarter deck:   15.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Average freeboard:      16.00 ft / 4.88 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 100.9 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 100.1 %
   Waterplane Area: 17,931 Square feet or 1,666 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 100 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 108 lbs/sq ft or 530 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.95
      - Longitudinal: 1.58
      - Overall: 1.00
   Adequate machinery, storage, compartmentation space
   Adequate accommodation and workspace room
   Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
   Excellent seaboat, comfortable, can fire her guns in the heaviest weather

Tumblehome hull.

Belt and end armor belts cover 12 feet vertically. Belt armor is equivalent to 9.24 inches of vertical armor, end armor is equivalent to 4.62 inches of vertical armor.

Miscellaneous weight:
20 tons hull below water is for 6 x 18 inch torpedo tubes (2 fore, 2 aft, 1 each broadside) with 3 x 1,250 pound torpedoes each.

Final TBD1, Russia Torpedo Boat Destroyer laid down 1898

Displacement:
   500 t light; 515 t standard; 595 t normal; 658 t full load

Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep)
   (250.00 ft / 250.00 ft) x 25.00 ft x (8.00 / 8.57 ft)
   (76.20 m / 76.20 m) x 7.62 m  x (2.44 / 2.61 m)

Armament:
      2 - 3.00" / 76.2 mm 50.0 cal guns - 20.00lbs / 9.07kg shells, 120 per gun
     Breech loading guns in deck mounts, 1898 Model
     2 x Single mounts on centreline ends, evenly spread
      Weight of broadside 40 lbs / 18 kg

Armour:
   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   1.00" / 25 mm         -               -

Machinery:
   Coal fired boilers, complex reciprocating steam engines,
   Direct drive, 2 shafts, 9,160 ihp / 6,833 Kw = 26.25 kts
   Range 3,000nm at 10.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 143 tons (100% coal)
     Caution: Delicate, lightweight machinery

Complement:
   59 - 78

Cost:
   £0.069 million / $0.277 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 5 tons, 0.9 %
      - Guns: 5 tons, 0.9 %
   Armour: 4 tons, 0.7 %
      - Armament: 4 tons, 0.7 %
   Machinery: 358 tons, 60.2 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 131 tons, 22.0 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 94 tons, 15.8 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 2 tons, 0.3 %
      - On freeboard deck: 2 tons

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     123 lbs / 56 Kg = 9.1 x 3.0 " / 76 mm shells or 0.2 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.64
   Metacentric height 1.4 ft / 0.4 m
   Roll period: 8.8 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 77 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.06
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1.24

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has raised forecastle,
     a normal bow and a cruiser stern
   Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0.416 / 0.430
   Length to Beam Ratio: 10.00 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 15.81 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 63 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 62
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): -10.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
   Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length):
            Fore end,    Aft end
      - Forecastle:   30.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Forward deck:   30.00 %,  8.00 ft / 2.44 m,  8.00 ft / 2.44 m
      - Aft deck:   25.00 %,  8.00 ft / 2.44 m,  8.00 ft / 2.44 m
      - Quarter deck:   15.00 %,  8.00 ft / 2.44 m,  8.00 ft / 2.44 m
      - Average freeboard:      10.40 ft / 3.17 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 197.0 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 100.4 %
   Waterplane Area: 3,886 Square feet or 361 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 20 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 18 lbs/sq ft or 90 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.45
      - Longitudinal: 1.32
      - Overall: 0.50
   Cramped machinery, storage, compartmentation space
   Adequate accommodation and workspace room
   Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
   Good seaboat, rides out heavy weather easily

Miscellaneous weight:
2 tons on deck is for 2 x 18 inch fore mounted torpedo tubes with 1x 1,250 pound torpedoes each (single shot).

Note that all 6" and smaller weapons are QF guns. I haven't changed them here, but when posted in my nation forum they will have the changes.

6" QF?  I don't think your loaders will thank you for that.  90 pound shell, plus 26.5 pound charge, plus a cartridge case weight of around 25-30 pounds.  It sure looked impressive when Canet demonstrated it (most likely ashore), though.

The old 2nd class BB had a lot of design flaws. There were also a number of other ships building in 1895 and I don't think they could have realistically been built than as well. These ships will replace them in the startup.

Final 2nd Class BB2, Russia Battleship laid down 1897

Displacement:
   7,000 t light; 7,360 t standard; 8,409 t normal; 9,249 t full load

Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep)
   (368.00 ft / 360.00 ft) x 66.00 ft (Bulges 72.00 ft) x (18.25 / 19.91 ft)
   (112.17 m / 109.73 m) x 20.12 m (Bulges 21.95 m)  x (5.56 / 6.07 m)

Armament:
      4 - 12.00" / 305 mm 35.0 cal guns - 749.99lbs / 340.19kg shells, 60 per gun
     Breech loading guns in turret on barbette mounts, 1897 Model
     2 x Twin mounts on centreline ends, evenly spread
      8 - 6.00" / 152 mm 45.0 cal guns - 89.99lbs / 40.82kg shells, 180 per gun
     Quick firing guns in casemate mounts, 1897 Model
     8 x Single mounts on sides, evenly spread
      8 - 3.00" / 76.2 mm 50.0 cal guns - 11.99lbs / 5.44kg shells, 360 per gun
     Quick firing guns in deck mounts, 1897 Model
     8 x Single mounts on centreline ends, evenly spread
      8 raised mounts
      Weight of broadside 3,816 lbs / 1,731 kg

Armour:
   - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   8.00" / 203 mm   234.00 ft / 71.32 m   9.24 ft / 2.82 m
   Ends:   4.00" / 102 mm   126.00 ft / 38.40 m   9.24 ft / 2.82 m
   Upper:   4.00" / 102 mm   234.00 ft / 71.32 m   8.00 ft / 2.44 m
     Main Belt covers 100 % of normal length
     Main Belt inclined -30.00 degrees (positive = in)

   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   8.00" / 203 mm   4.00" / 102 mm      6.00" / 152 mm
   2nd:   3.00" / 76 mm         -               -
   3rd:   1.00" / 25 mm         -               -

   - Armoured deck - single deck:
   For and Aft decks: 1.50" / 38 mm
   Forecastle: 1.50" / 38 mm  Quarter deck: 1.50" / 38 mm

   - Conning towers: Forward 10.00" / 254 mm, Aft 10.00" / 254 mm

Machinery:
   Coal fired boilers, complex reciprocating steam engines,
   Direct drive, 2 shafts, 8,920 ihp / 6,655 Kw = 17.15 kts
   Range 8,000nm at 10.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 1,889 tons (100% coal)

Complement:
   438 - 570

Cost:
   £0.733 million / $2.930 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 620 tons, 7.4 %
      - Guns: 620 tons, 7.4 %
   Armour: 2,329 tons, 27.7 %
      - Belts: 1,285 tons, 15.3 %
      - Armament: 369 tons, 4.4 %
      - Armour Deck: 496 tons, 5.9 %
      - Conning Towers: 178 tons, 2.1 %
   Machinery: 1,462 tons, 17.4 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 2,569 tons, 30.6 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 1,409 tons, 16.8 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 20 tons, 0.2 %
      - Hull below water: 20 tons

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     10,249 lbs / 4,649 Kg = 11.9 x 12.0 " / 305 mm shells or 1.8 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.54
   Metacentric height 5.6 ft / 1.7 m
   Roll period: 12.8 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 75 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.27
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1.30

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has a flush deck,
     a ram bow and a cruiser stern
   Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0.622 / 0.627
   Length to Beam Ratio: 5.00 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 18.97 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 48 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 58
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): -10.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
   Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length):
            Fore end,    Aft end
      - Forecastle:   20.00 %,  12.00 ft / 3.66 m,  12.00 ft / 3.66 m
      - Forward deck:   30.00 %,  12.00 ft / 3.66 m,  12.00 ft / 3.66 m
      - Aft deck:   35.00 %,  12.00 ft / 3.66 m,  12.00 ft / 3.66 m
      - Quarter deck:   15.00 %,  12.00 ft / 3.66 m,  12.00 ft / 3.66 m
      - Average freeboard:      12.00 ft / 3.66 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 87.6 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 92.6 %
   Waterplane Area: 17,741 Square feet or 1,648 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 106 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 119 lbs/sq ft or 581 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.94
      - Longitudinal: 1.68
      - Overall: 1.00
   Adequate machinery, storage, compartmentation space
   Adequate accommodation and workspace room
   Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
   Good seaboat, rides out heavy weather easily

Tumblehome hull.

Belt and end armor belts cover 8 feet vertically. Belt armor is equivalent to 9.24 inches of vertical armor, end armor is equivalent to 4.62 inches of vertical armor.

Miscellaneous weight:
20 tons hull below water is for 6 x 18 inch torpedo tubes (2 fore, 2 aft, 1 each broadside) with 3 x 1,250 pound torpedoes each.

Final BM1, Russia Monitor laid down 1897

Displacement:
   3,000 t light; 3,138 t standard; 3,390 t normal; 3,591 t full load

Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep)
   (240.00 ft / 240.00 ft) x 56.50 ft x (12.50 / 13.15 ft)
   (73.15 m / 73.15 m) x 17.22 m  x (3.81 / 4.01 m)

Armament:
      2 - 12.00" / 305 mm 35.0 cal guns - 749.99lbs / 340.19kg shells, 60 per gun
     Breech loading guns in turret on barbette mount, 1897 Model
     1 x Twin mount on centreline, forward deck centre
      4 - 4.72" / 120 mm 45.0 cal guns - 50.00lbs / 22.68kg shells, 180 per gun
     Quick firing guns in deck mounts, 1897 Model
     4 x Single mounts on sides, evenly spread
      4 raised mounts
      Weight of broadside 1,700 lbs / 771 kg

Armour:
   - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   10.0" / 254 mm   156.00 ft / 47.55 m   9.00 ft / 2.74 m
   Ends:   4.00" / 102 mm     84.00 ft / 25.60 m   9.00 ft / 2.74 m
     Main Belt covers 100 % of normal length

   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   10.0" / 254 mm   4.00" / 102 mm      8.00" / 203 mm
   2nd:   1.00" / 25 mm         -               -

   - Armoured deck - single deck:
   For and Aft decks: 2.00" / 51 mm
   Forecastle: 2.00" / 51 mm  Quarter deck: 2.00" / 51 mm

   - Conning towers: Forward 8.00" / 203 mm, Aft 8.00" / 203 mm

Machinery:
   Coal fired boilers, complex reciprocating steam engines,
   Direct drive, 2 shafts, 1,525 ihp / 1,138 Kw = 11.93 kts
   Range 3,000nm at 10.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 452 tons (100% coal)

Complement:
   221 - 288

Cost:
   £0.268 million / $1.071 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 261 tons, 7.7 %
      - Guns: 261 tons, 7.7 %
   Armour: 1,393 tons, 41.1 %
      - Belts: 783 tons, 23.1 %
      - Armament: 127 tons, 3.7 %
      - Armour Deck: 405 tons, 12.0 %
      - Conning Towers: 78 tons, 2.3 %
   Machinery: 250 tons, 7.4 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 1,096 tons, 32.3 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 389 tons, 11.5 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 0 tons, 0.0 %

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     5,317 lbs / 2,412 Kg = 6.2 x 12.0 " / 305 mm shells or 1.9 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.58
   Metacentric height 4.6 ft / 1.4 m
   Roll period: 11.1 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 50 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.13
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 0.79

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has a flush deck,
     a normal bow and a cruiser stern
   Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0.700 / 0.705
   Length to Beam Ratio: 4.25 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 15.49 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 42 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 64
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 0.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
   Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length):
            Fore end,    Aft end
      - Forecastle:   25.00 %,  5.00 ft / 1.52 m,  5.00 ft / 1.52 m
      - Forward deck:   30.00 %,  5.00 ft / 1.52 m,  5.00 ft / 1.52 m
      - Aft deck:   30.00 %,  5.00 ft / 1.52 m,  5.00 ft / 1.52 m
      - Quarter deck:   15.00 %,  5.00 ft / 1.52 m,  5.00 ft / 1.52 m
      - Average freeboard:      5.00 ft / 1.52 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 58.4 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 46.8 %
   Waterplane Area: 10,868 Square feet or 1,010 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 109 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 97 lbs/sq ft or 473 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.97
      - Longitudinal: 1.32
      - Overall: 1.00
   Excellent machinery, storage, compartmentation space
   Extremely poor accommodation and workspace room
   Poor seaboat, wet and uncomfortable, reduced performance in heavy weather

After experiments with stacked turrets and heavy casemate guns on the Tsesarevich class battleships, the IRN has decided to return to more conventional designs for the Borodino class. Improvements in the rate of fire of heavy guns has led to the replacement of 8" guns with 10" guns on the Borodino. A slightly more powerful powerplant has also been adopted for the first time on the 12,570 ton battleships.

Borodino Class, Russia Battleship laid down 1900

Displacement:
   12,570 t light; 13,141 t standard; 14,500 t normal; 15,588 t full load

Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep)
   (392.00 ft / 384.00 ft) x 74.00 ft (Bulges 80.00 ft) x (26.25 / 28.03 ft)
   (119.48 m / 117.04 m) x 22.56 m (Bulges 24.38 m)  x (8.00 / 8.54 m)

Armament:
      4 - 12.00" / 305 mm 40.0 cal guns - 749.99lbs / 340.19kg shells, 60 per gun
     Breech loading guns in turret on barbette mounts, 1900 Model
     2 x Twin mounts on centreline ends, evenly spread
      8 - 10.00" / 254 mm 45.0 cal guns - 500.01lbs / 226.80kg shells, 60 per gun
     Breech loading guns in turret on barbette mounts, 1900 Model
     4 x Twin mounts on sides, evenly spread
      12 - 3.00" / 76.2 mm 50.0 cal guns - 11.99lbs / 5.44kg shells, 360 per gun
     Breech loading guns in casemate mounts, 1900 Model
     12 x Single mounts on sides, evenly spread
      12 hull mounts in casemates- Limited use in heavy seas
      8 - 3.00" / 76.2 mm 50.0 cal guns - 11.99lbs / 5.44kg shells, 360 per gun
     Quick firing guns in deck mounts, 1900 Model
     8 x Single mounts on centreline ends, evenly spread
      8 raised mounts
      Weight of broadside 7,240 lbs / 3,284 kg

Armour:
   - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   12.0" / 305 mm   250.00 ft / 76.20 m   13.86 ft / 4.22 m
   Ends:   5.00" / 127 mm   134.00 ft / 40.84 m   13.86 ft / 4.22 m
   Upper:   5.00" / 127 mm   250.00 ft / 76.20 m   8.00 ft / 2.44 m
     Main Belt covers 100 % of normal length
     Main Belt inclined -30.00 degrees (positive = in)

   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   12.0" / 305 mm   5.00" / 127 mm      10.0" / 254 mm
   3rd:   6.00" / 152 mm   3.00" / 76 mm      6.00" / 152 mm
   4th:   3.00" / 76 mm         -               -
   5th:   1.00" / 25 mm         -               -

   - Armoured deck - single deck:
   For and Aft decks: 2.00" / 51 mm
   Forecastle: 2.00" / 51 mm  Quarter deck: 2.00" / 51 mm

   - Conning towers: Forward 10.00" / 254 mm, Aft 10.00" / 254 mm

Machinery:
   Coal fired boilers, complex reciprocating steam engines,
   Direct drive, 2 shafts, 12,360 ihp / 9,221 Kw = 17.25 kts
   Range 8,000nm at 10.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 2,447 tons (100% coal)

Complement:
   659 - 858

Cost:
   £1.378 million / $5.513 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 1,475 tons, 10.2 %
      - Guns: 1,475 tons, 10.2 %
   Armour: 4,920 tons, 33.9 %
      - Belts: 2,686 tons, 18.5 %
      - Armament: 1,181 tons, 8.1 %
      - Armour Deck: 797 tons, 5.5 %
      - Conning Towers: 256 tons, 1.8 %
   Machinery: 1,931 tons, 13.3 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 3,924 tons, 27.1 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 1,931 tons, 13.3 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 320 tons, 2.2 %
      - Hull below water: 20 tons
      - Above deck: 300 tons

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     16,179 lbs / 7,339 Kg = 18.7 x 12.0 " / 305 mm shells or 2.3 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.27
   Metacentric height 4.9 ft / 1.5 m
   Roll period: 15.2 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 75 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.54
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1.53

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has a flush deck,
     a ram bow and a cruiser stern
   Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0.629 / 0.634
   Length to Beam Ratio: 4.80 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 19.60 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 49 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 49
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): -10.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
   Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length):
            Fore end,    Aft end
      - Forecastle:   20.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Forward deck:   30.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Aft deck:   35.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Quarter deck:   15.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Average freeboard:      16.00 ft / 4.88 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 84.2 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 98.8 %
   Waterplane Area: 21,358 Square feet or 1,984 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 94 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 147 lbs/sq ft or 718 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.90
      - Longitudinal: 2.54
      - Overall: 1.00
   Adequate machinery, storage, compartmentation space
   Adequate accommodation and workspace room
   Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
   Excellent seaboat, comfortable, can fire her guns in the heaviest weather

Tumblehome hull.

Belt and end armor belts cover 12 feet vertically. Belt armor is equivalent to 13.86 inches of vertical armor, end armor is equivalent to 5.77 inches of vertical armor.

Miscellaneous weight:
20 tons hull below water is for 6 x 18 inch torpedo tubes (2 fore, 2 aft, 1 each broadside) with 3 x 1,250 pound torpedoes each.
300 tons above deck reserve weight.

The IRN was satisfied with the armor and armament of the Nepobedimyy class but was unsatisfied with its low top speed relative to foreign designs. The Admiral Nakhimov is almost 1.5 knots faster than previous IRN armored cruisers but its draught has also increased, making it more difficult for the cruiser to operate in shallower waters in the Baltic and Asia.

Admiral Nakhimov Class, Russia Armored Cruiser laid down 1900

Displacement:
   11,200 t light; 11,675 t standard; 12,974 t normal; 14,012 t full load

Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep)
   (488.00 ft / 480.00 ft) x 54.00 ft (Bulges 60.00 ft) x (26.25 / 28.17 ft)
   (148.74 m / 146.30 m) x 16.46 m (Bulges 18.29 m)  x (8.00 / 8.59 m)

Armament:
      4 - 10.00" / 254 mm 45.0 cal guns - 500.01lbs / 226.80kg shells, 80 per gun
     Breech loading guns in turret on barbette mounts, 1900 Model
     2 x Twin mounts on centreline ends, evenly spread
      12 - 6.00" / 152 mm 45.0 cal guns - 89.99lbs / 40.82kg shells, 180 per gun
     Quick firing guns in casemate mounts, 1900 Model
     12 x Single mounts on sides, evenly spread
      8 - 3.00" / 76.2 mm 50.0 cal guns - 11.99lbs / 5.44kg shells, 360 per gun
     Quick firing guns in deck mounts, 1900 Model
     8 x Single mounts on centreline ends, evenly spread
      8 raised mounts
      Weight of broadside 3,176 lbs / 1,441 kg

Armour:
   - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   8.00" / 203 mm   344.00 ft / 104.85 m   13.86 ft / 4.22 m
   Ends:   4.00" / 102 mm   136.00 ft / 41.45 m   13.86 ft / 4.22 m
   Upper:   4.00" / 102 mm   344.00 ft / 104.85 m   8.00 ft / 2.44 m
     Main Belt covers 110 % of normal length
     Main Belt inclined -30.00 degrees (positive = in)

   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   8.00" / 203 mm   4.00" / 102 mm      8.00" / 203 mm
   2nd:   3.00" / 76 mm         -               -
   3rd:   1.00" / 25 mm         -               -

   - Armoured deck - single deck:
   For and Aft decks: 1.50" / 38 mm
   Forecastle: 1.50" / 38 mm  Quarter deck: 1.50" / 38 mm

   - Conning towers: Forward 10.00" / 254 mm, Aft 10.00" / 254 mm

Machinery:
   Coal fired boilers, complex reciprocating steam engines,
   Direct drive, 2 shafts, 23,340 ihp / 17,411 Kw = 21.44 kts
   Range 8,000nm at 10.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 2,337 tons (100% coal)

Complement:
   607 - 790

Cost:
   £1.159 million / $4.637 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 695 tons, 5.4 %
      - Guns: 695 tons, 5.4 %
   Armour: 3,517 tons, 27.1 %
      - Belts: 2,297 tons, 17.7 %
      - Armament: 451 tons, 3.5 %
      - Armour Deck: 531 tons, 4.1 %
      - Conning Towers: 238 tons, 1.8 %
   Machinery: 3,647 tons, 28.1 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 3,047 tons, 23.5 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 1,774 tons, 13.7 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 295 tons, 2.3 %
      - Hull below water: 20 tons
      - Above deck: 275 tons

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     9,595 lbs / 4,352 Kg = 19.2 x 10.0 " / 254 mm shells or 1.3 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.15
   Metacentric height 2.6 ft / 0.8 m
   Roll period: 15.7 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 75 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.57
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1.42

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has a flush deck,
     a ram bow and a cruiser stern
   Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0.601 / 0.605
   Length to Beam Ratio: 8.00 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 21.91 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 47 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 53
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): -10.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
   Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length):
            Fore end,    Aft end
      - Forecastle:   20.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Forward deck:   30.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Aft deck:   35.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Quarter deck:   15.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Average freeboard:      16.00 ft / 4.88 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 109.8 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 95.2 %
   Waterplane Area: 18,969 Square feet or 1,762 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 96 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 105 lbs/sq ft or 514 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.95
      - Longitudinal: 1.51
      - Overall: 1.00
   Adequate machinery, storage, compartmentation space
   Adequate accommodation and workspace room
   Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
   Good seaboat, rides out heavy weather easily

Tumblehome hull.

Belt and end armor belts cover 12 feet vertically. Belt armor is equivalent to 9.24 inches of vertical armor, end armor is equivalent to 4.62 inches of vertical armor.

Miscellaneous weight:
20 tons hull below water is for 6 x 18 inch torpedo tubes (2 fore, 2 aft, 1 each broadside) with 3 x 1,250 pound torpedoes each.
275 tons above deck reserve weight.

QuoteLength to Beam Ratio: 8.00 : 1

IMO, decrease to 7.50 & draught too to have higher survivability.

Jef

I decided that reducing draught was most important. Reducing the length to beam ratio would have made the ship very large.

Admiral Nakhimov Class, Russia Armored Cruiser laid down 1900

Displacement:
   11,820 t light; 12,309 t standard; 13,668 t normal; 14,756 t full load

Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep)
   (528.00 ft / 520.00 ft) x 57.00 ft (Bulges 63.00 ft) x (24.00 / 25.74 ft)
   (160.93 m / 158.50 m) x 17.37 m (Bulges 19.20 m)  x (7.32 / 7.85 m)

Armament:
      4 - 10.00" / 254 mm 45.0 cal guns - 500.01lbs / 226.80kg shells, 80 per gun
     Breech loading guns in turret on barbette mounts, 1900 Model
     2 x Twin mounts on centreline ends, evenly spread
      12 - 6.00" / 152 mm 45.0 cal guns - 89.99lbs / 40.82kg shells, 180 per gun
     Quick firing guns in casemate mounts, 1900 Model
     12 x Single mounts on sides, evenly spread
      8 - 3.00" / 76.2 mm 50.0 cal guns - 11.99lbs / 5.44kg shells, 360 per gun
     Quick firing guns in deck mounts, 1900 Model
     8 x Single mounts on centreline ends, evenly spread
      8 raised mounts
      Weight of broadside 3,176 lbs / 1,441 kg

Armour:
   - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   8.00" / 203 mm   356.00 ft / 108.51 m   13.86 ft / 4.22 m
   Ends:   4.00" / 102 mm   164.00 ft / 49.99 m   13.86 ft / 4.22 m
   Upper:   4.00" / 102 mm   356.00 ft / 108.51 m   8.00 ft / 2.44 m
     Main Belt covers 105 % of normal length
     Main Belt inclined -30.00 degrees (positive = in)

   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   8.00" / 203 mm   4.00" / 102 mm      8.00" / 203 mm
   2nd:   3.00" / 76 mm         -               -
   3rd:   1.00" / 25 mm         -               -

   - Armoured deck - single deck:
   For and Aft decks: 1.50" / 38 mm
   Forecastle: 1.50" / 38 mm  Quarter deck: 1.50" / 38 mm

   - Conning towers: Forward 10.00" / 254 mm, Aft 10.00" / 254 mm

Machinery:
   Coal fired boilers, complex reciprocating steam engines,
   Direct drive, 2 shafts, 23,600 ihp / 17,606 Kw = 21.44 kts
   Range 8,000nm at 10.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 2,447 tons (100% coal)

Complement:
   631 - 821

Cost:
   £1.187 million / $4.747 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 695 tons, 5.1 %
      - Guns: 695 tons, 5.1 %
   Armour: 3,746 tons, 27.4 %
      - Belts: 2,437 tons, 17.8 %
      - Armament: 451 tons, 3.3 %
      - Armour Deck: 611 tons, 4.5 %
      - Conning Towers: 246 tons, 1.8 %
   Machinery: 3,688 tons, 27.0 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 3,397 tons, 24.9 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 1,849 tons, 13.5 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 295 tons, 2.2 %
      - Hull below water: 20 tons
      - Above deck: 275 tons

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     11,761 lbs / 5,335 Kg = 23.5 x 10.0 " / 254 mm shells or 1.5 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.22
   Metacentric height 3.1 ft / 0.9 m
   Roll period: 15.0 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 75 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.46
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1.48

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has a flush deck,
     a ram bow and a cruiser stern
   Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0.608 / 0.612
   Length to Beam Ratio: 8.25 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 22.80 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 45 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 51
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): -10.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
   Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length):
            Fore end,    Aft end
      - Forecastle:   20.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Forward deck:   30.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Aft deck:   35.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Quarter deck:   15.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Average freeboard:      16.00 ft / 4.88 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 105.3 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 105.5 %
   Waterplane Area: 21,850 Square feet or 2,030 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 99 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 106 lbs/sq ft or 520 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.98
      - Longitudinal: 1.20
      - Overall: 1.00
   Adequate machinery, storage, compartmentation space
   Adequate accommodation and workspace room
   Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
   Good seaboat, rides out heavy weather easily

Tumblehome hull.

Belt and end armor belts cover 12 feet vertically. Belt armor is equivalent to 9.24 inches of vertical armor, end armor is equivalent to 4.62 inches of vertical armor.

Miscellaneous weight:
20 tons hull below water is for 6 x 18 inch torpedo tubes (2 fore, 2 aft, 1 each broadside) with 3 x 1,250 pound torpedoes each.
275 tons above deck reserve weight.

You've missed the torpedo tubes in the actual sim, I think.

Just curious - is Russia designing different fleets for different regions, or trying to standardize?

We're using miscellaneous weight to track torps, because SS3.b3 has a flaw in that it calculates the amount torps & tubes would weigh, but doesn't actually apply that value to the design until the design is reloaded from a saved file.  That means if you make a design with the torps in the design, AND include misc weight for them, if you reload the design after saving it you'll be double-counting the weight of the torps.  Not a huge deal, generally, on bigger ships, but it will definitely cause problems on TBs and other smaller ships.

Quote from: The Rock Doctor on November 26, 2012, 08:00:57 PM
You've missed the torpedo tubes in the actual sim, I think.

Just curious - is Russia designing different fleets for different regions, or trying to standardize?

I sim torpedoes and mines as miscellaneous weight so I don't have to worry about changing the armament while I work on designs. Sometimes you can end up with weight not being counted or being double counted if you do not do things that way.

As for the fleets, I am essentially carrying out the naval planning as if each fleet were its own navy. The Baltic fleet is going to be more of a traditional navy with full sized battleships and a few armored cruisers. It is the fleet that is expected to do the majority of the fighting in the event of war with another European power. The Black Sea fleet is going to be more of a coastal defense fleet, with monitors, destroyers, and second class battleships roaming around. The ships there are not as seaworthy or long ranged, but they don't really have to be. The Pacific fleet is based more around cruisers of various types as battleships would require too many crew members and consume too many resources. The Pacific fleet is intended to defend against European colonial fleets and the Chinese Navy, and if Japan were to attack the ships are to act as commerce raiders until reinforcements can arrive.

I suppose you can consider there to be a fourth fleet for the ships intended for service on the various rivers of Russia and the Caspian Sea, but I haven't sat down to design any ships for such service yet.

Here is a scouting cruiser for the navy.

Scout Cruiser, Russia Scout Cruiser laid down 1900

Displacement:
   3,640 t light; 3,786 t standard; 4,293 t normal; 4,698 t full load

Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep)
   (392.00 ft / 392.00 ft) x 40.00 ft x (14.75 / 15.93 ft)
   (119.48 m / 119.48 m) x 12.19 m  x (4.50 / 4.86 m)

Armament:
      12 - 4.72" / 120 mm 45.0 cal guns - 50.00lbs / 22.68kg shells, 180 per gun
     Breech loading guns in deck mounts, 1900 Model
     2 x Single mounts on centreline ends, evenly spread
     10 x Single mounts on sides, evenly spread
      Weight of broadside 600 lbs / 272 kg

Armour:
   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   1.00" / 25 mm         -               -

Machinery:
   Coal fired boilers, complex reciprocating steam engines,
   Direct drive, 2 shafts, 16,000 ihp / 11,936 Kw = 22.75 kts
   Range 6,000nm at 10.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 912 tons (100% coal)

Complement:
   264 - 344

Cost:
   £0.497 million / $1.989 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 98 tons, 2.3 %
      - Guns: 98 tons, 2.3 %
   Armour: 30 tons, 0.7 %
      - Armament: 30 tons, 0.7 %
   Machinery: 2,425 tons, 56.5 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 1,087 tons, 25.3 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 653 tons, 15.2 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 0 tons, 0.0 %

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     1,457 lbs / 661 Kg = 27.7 x 4.7 " / 120 mm shells or 0.4 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.78
   Metacentric height 3.2 ft / 1.0 m
   Roll period: 9.3 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 75 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.13
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1.12

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has a flush deck,
     a normal bow and a cruiser stern
   Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0.650 / 0.658
   Length to Beam Ratio: 9.80 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 19.80 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 53 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 67
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): -10.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
   Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length):
            Fore end,    Aft end
      - Forecastle:   30.00 %,  13.00 ft / 3.96 m,  11.50 ft / 3.51 m
      - Forward deck:   30.00 %,  11.50 ft / 3.51 m,  10.00 ft / 3.05 m
      - Aft deck:   25.00 %,  10.00 ft / 3.05 m,  10.00 ft / 3.05 m
      - Quarter deck:   15.00 %,  10.00 ft / 3.05 m,  10.00 ft / 3.05 m
      - Average freeboard:      10.86 ft / 3.31 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 189.7 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 90.2 %
   Waterplane Area: 12,007 Square feet or 1,116 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 81 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 63 lbs/sq ft or 310 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 1.08
      - Longitudinal: 0.97
      - Overall: 1.00
   Cramped machinery, storage, compartmentation space
   Adequate accommodation and workspace room
   Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform

I don't think it is quite fast enough to be a scout. Then again, I don't think we will see "proper" scouts until turbines exist and mature a bit. You can get away with higher freeboard to raise seakeeping, I would look into it. I also feel that 12x120mm is just a bit to tight on deck space, 10 would be a bit better and make the ship less of a floating powered bomb IMO. Also, some torps couldn't hurt in place of a few of those guns. Good concept tho, good little, quick hull that will be a great base for a cruiser.

I've revised the design to increase the top speed, raise the freeboard, and add torpedoes. It's probably the best design possible in its weight category until turbines and oil firing are developed.

Scout Cruiser, Russia Scout Cruiser laid down 1900

Displacement:
   3,650 t light; 3,786 t standard; 4,293 t normal; 4,698 t full load

Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep)
   (392.00 ft / 392.00 ft) x 40.00 ft x (14.75 / 15.93 ft)
   (119.48 m / 119.48 m) x 12.19 m  x (4.50 / 4.86 m)

Armament:
      10 - 4.72" / 120 mm 45.0 cal guns - 50.00lbs / 22.68kg shells, 180 per gun
     Breech loading guns in deck mounts, 1900 Model
     2 x Single mounts on centreline ends, evenly spread
     8 x Single mounts on sides, evenly spread
      Weight of broadside 500 lbs / 227 kg

Armour:
   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   1.00" / 25 mm         -               -

Machinery:
   Coal fired boilers, complex reciprocating steam engines,
   Direct drive, 2 shafts, 16,440 ihp / 12,264 Kw = 22.91 kts
   Range 6,000nm at 10.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 912 tons (100% coal)

Complement:
   264 - 344

Cost:
   £0.501 million / $2.004 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 81 tons, 1.9 %
      - Guns: 81 tons, 1.9 %
   Armour: 25 tons, 0.6 %
      - Armament: 25 tons, 0.6 %
   Machinery: 2,485 tons, 57.9 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 1,039 tons, 24.2 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 643 tons, 15.0 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 20 tons, 0.5 %
      - On freeboard deck: 20 tons

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     1,473 lbs / 668 Kg = 28.0 x 4.7 " / 120 mm shells or 0.4 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.80
   Metacentric height 3.3 ft / 1.0 m
   Roll period: 9.3 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 75 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.11
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1.20

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has a flush deck,
     a normal bow and a cruiser stern
   Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0.650 / 0.658
   Length to Beam Ratio: 9.80 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 19.80 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 53 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 62
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): -10.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
   Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length):
            Fore end,    Aft end
      - Forecastle:   30.00 %,  14.00 ft / 4.27 m,  12.50 ft / 3.81 m
      - Forward deck:   30.00 %,  12.50 ft / 3.81 m,  11.00 ft / 3.35 m
      - Aft deck:   25.00 %,  11.00 ft / 3.35 m,  11.00 ft / 3.35 m
      - Quarter deck:   15.00 %,  11.00 ft / 3.35 m,  11.00 ft / 3.35 m
      - Average freeboard:      11.86 ft / 3.61 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 192.9 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 98.8 %
   Waterplane Area: 12,007 Square feet or 1,116 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 79 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 59 lbs/sq ft or 288 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 1.00
      - Longitudinal: 0.99
      - Overall: 1.00
   Cramped machinery, storage, compartmentation space
   Adequate accommodation and workspace room
   Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
   Good seaboat, rides out heavy weather easily

Miscellaneous weight:
20 tons on deck is for 6 x 18 inch torpedo tubes (2 fore, 2 aft, 1 each broadside) with 3 x 1,250 pound torpedoes each.

I'm strangely fond of it. Good one.

not realy my cup of tea but not a bad little cruiser.

Quote from: Tanthalas on November 27, 2012, 12:43:47 AM
not realy my cup of tea but not a bad little cruiser.

Not speedy enough for you?

Good little raider and finder of the enemy, though it might want to fit a wireless.  As a raider, it's armament's OK, though I might trade some of the 12cms for a couple of 6" guns to sink things quicker. 

actualy the speed is good, but that heavy I would proly want some 6" guns or even a pair of 8".  I'm not planing a cruiser laydown till 1902 though so im not exactly sure what the new lights will end up looking like (I have played around with several diferent ideas)

Quote from: Delta Force on November 27, 2012, 12:52:15 AM

Quote from: Tanthalas on November 27, 2012, 12:43:47 AM
not realy my cup of tea but not a bad little cruiser.

Not speedy enough for you?

You might want to consider some armor, at least for the Conning Tower. I don't think it's worth belt or deck armor as speed is far more important.

Modified for armor and a radio. I've decided to keep the armament it currently has rather than equip the cruiser with some 6" guns because it would make the ship too large to be unarmored in my view.

Scout Cruiser, Russia Scout Cruiser laid down 1900

Displacement:
   3,750 t light; 3,888 t standard; 4,401 t normal; 4,812 t full load

Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep)
   (392.00 ft / 392.00 ft) x 40.00 ft x (15.25 / 16.45 ft)
   (119.48 m / 119.48 m) x 12.19 m  x (4.65 / 5.01 m)

Armament:
      10 - 4.72" / 120 mm 45.0 cal guns - 50.00lbs / 22.68kg shells, 180 per gun
     Breech loading guns in deck mounts, 1900 Model
     2 x Single mounts on centreline ends, evenly spread
     8 x Single mounts on sides, evenly spread
      Weight of broadside 500 lbs / 227 kg

Armour:
   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   1.00" / 25 mm         -               -

   - Conning towers: Forward 3.00" / 76 mm, Aft 0.00" / 0 mm

Machinery:
   Coal fired boilers, complex reciprocating steam engines,
   Direct drive, 2 shafts, 16,660 ihp / 12,428 Kw = 22.92 kts
   Range 6,000nm at 10.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 924 tons (100% coal)

Complement:
   269 - 351

Cost:
   £0.511 million / $2.045 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 81 tons, 1.8 %
      - Guns: 81 tons, 1.8 %
   Armour: 42 tons, 1.0 %
      - Armament: 25 tons, 0.6 %
      - Conning Tower: 17 tons, 0.4 %
   Machinery: 2,533 tons, 57.5 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 1,049 tons, 23.8 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 651 tons, 14.8 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 45 tons, 1.0 %
      - On freeboard deck: 20 tons
      - Above deck: 25 tons

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     1,464 lbs / 664 Kg = 27.8 x 4.7 " / 120 mm shells or 0.4 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.69
   Metacentric height 3.0 ft / 0.9 m
   Roll period: 9.7 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 75 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.12
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1.19

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has a flush deck,
     a normal bow and a cruiser stern
   Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0.644 / 0.653
   Length to Beam Ratio: 9.80 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 19.80 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 53 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 63
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): -10.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
   Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length):
            Fore end,    Aft end
      - Forecastle:   30.00 %,  14.00 ft / 4.27 m,  12.50 ft / 3.81 m
      - Forward deck:   30.00 %,  12.50 ft / 3.81 m,  11.00 ft / 3.35 m
      - Aft deck:   25.00 %,  11.00 ft / 3.35 m,  11.00 ft / 3.35 m
      - Quarter deck:   15.00 %,  11.00 ft / 3.35 m,  11.00 ft / 3.35 m
      - Average freeboard:      11.86 ft / 3.61 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 191.7 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 96.5 %
   Waterplane Area: 11,948 Square feet or 1,110 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 80 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 59 lbs/sq ft or 290 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.99
      - Longitudinal: 1.02
      - Overall: 1.00
   Cramped machinery, storage, compartmentation space
   Adequate accommodation and workspace room
   Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform

Miscellaneous weight:
20 tons on deck is for 6 x 18 inch torpedo tubes (2 fore, 2 aft, 1 each broadside) with 3 x 1,250 pound torpedoes each.
25 tons above deck reserve weight.

Im wondering what the ship would look like with a mix of 6" and a smaller (about 3") guns. The 120mm just seems a bit to "soft" to me.

IDK you can get 3X6" and 8X4.7 easy enough on 3500 tons light and still hit 23 knots...

Quote from: snip on December 02, 2012, 08:32:12 PM
Im wondering what the ship would look like with a mix of 6" and a smaller (about 3") guns. The 120mm just seems a bit to "soft" to me.

Somewhat related to this cruiser design, if I have a tonnage reserve for future ship growth (such as masts and additional guns that are not yet fitted) that miscellaneous weight doesn't count for ship construction, right?

Quote from: Delta Force on December 02, 2012, 09:17:51 PM
Somewhat related to this cruiser design, if I have a tonnage reserve for future ship growth (such as masts and additional guns that are not yet fitted) that miscellaneous weight doesn't count for ship construction, right?

I have always just payed for it (take that as a hint)

I think 10x12cm is a pretty decent armament for a light cruiser of this time. Remember that the German small cruisers only had (around 10) 105mm guns until about 1914.

I was toying around with this design and I think it is possible under the current rules (10 inch guns are not "big guns").

Uniform Battery Battleship, Russia Battleship laid down 1900

Displacement:
   15,000 t light; 15,659 t standard; 17,210 t normal; 18,451 t full load

Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep)
   (488.00 ft / 480.00 ft) x 74.00 ft (Bulges 80.00 ft) x (24.00 / 25.59 ft)
   (148.74 m / 146.30 m) x 22.56 m (Bulges 24.38 m)  x (7.32 / 7.80 m)

Armament:
      4 - 10.00" / 254 mm 45.0 cal guns - 500.01lbs / 226.80kg shells, 60 per gun
     Breech loading guns in turret on barbette mounts, 1900 Model
     2 x Twin mounts on centreline ends, evenly spread
      12 - 10.00" / 254 mm 45.0 cal guns - 500.01lbs / 226.80kg shells, 60 per gun
     Breech loading guns in turret on barbette mounts, 1900 Model
     6 x Twin mounts on sides, evenly spread
      12 - 3.00" / 76.2 mm 50.0 cal guns - 11.99lbs / 5.44kg shells, 360 per gun
     Breech loading guns in casemate mounts, 1900 Model
     12 x Single mounts on sides, evenly spread
      12 hull mounts in casemates- Limited use in heavy seas
      8 - 3.00" / 76.2 mm 50.0 cal guns - 11.99lbs / 5.44kg shells, 360 per gun
     Quick firing guns in deck mounts, 1900 Model
     8 x Single mounts on centreline ends, evenly spread
      8 raised mounts
      Weight of broadside 8,240 lbs / 3,738 kg

Armour:
   - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   10.0" / 254 mm   312.00 ft / 95.10 m   13.86 ft / 4.22 m
   Ends:   4.00" / 102 mm   168.00 ft / 51.21 m   13.86 ft / 4.22 m
   Upper:   4.00" / 102 mm   312.00 ft / 95.10 m   8.00 ft / 2.44 m
     Main Belt covers 100 % of normal length
     Main Belt inclined -30.00 degrees (positive = in)

   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   10.0" / 254 mm   4.00" / 102 mm      8.00" / 203 mm
   3rd:   10.0" / 254 mm   4.00" / 102 mm      8.00" / 203 mm
   4th:   3.00" / 76 mm         -               -
   5th:   1.00" / 25 mm         -               -

   - Armoured deck - single deck:
   For and Aft decks: 2.00" / 51 mm
   Forecastle: 2.00" / 51 mm  Quarter deck: 2.00" / 51 mm

   - Conning towers: Forward 10.00" / 254 mm, Aft 10.00" / 254 mm

Machinery:
   Coal fired boilers, complex reciprocating steam engines,
   Direct drive, 2 shafts, 16,400 ihp / 12,235 Kw = 18.42 kts
   Range 8,000nm at 10.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 2,793 tons (100% coal)

Complement:
   750 - 976

Cost:
   £1.654 million / $6.616 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 1,847 tons, 10.7 %
      - Guns: 1,847 tons, 10.7 %
   Armour: 5,541 tons, 32.2 %
      - Belts: 2,680 tons, 15.6 %
      - Armament: 1,556 tons, 9.0 %
      - Armour Deck: 1,018 tons, 5.9 %
      - Conning Towers: 287 tons, 1.7 %
   Machinery: 2,563 tons, 14.9 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 4,729 tons, 27.5 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 2,210 tons, 12.8 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 320 tons, 1.9 %
      - Hull below water: 20 tons
      - Above deck: 300 tons

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     18,638 lbs / 8,454 Kg = 37.3 x 10.0 " / 254 mm shells or 2.3 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.23
   Metacentric height 4.7 ft / 1.4 m
   Roll period: 15.6 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 75 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.60
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1.50

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has a flush deck,
     a ram bow and a cruiser stern
   Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0.654 / 0.657
   Length to Beam Ratio: 6.00 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 21.91 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 44 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 50
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): -10.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
   Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length):
            Fore end,    Aft end
      - Forecastle:   20.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Forward deck:   30.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Aft deck:   35.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Quarter deck:   15.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Average freeboard:      16.00 ft / 4.88 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 88.0 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 110.9 %
   Waterplane Area: 27,300 Square feet or 2,536 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 94 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 145 lbs/sq ft or 709 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.95
      - Longitudinal: 1.49
      - Overall: 1.00
   Adequate machinery, storage, compartmentation space
   Adequate accommodation and workspace room
   Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
   Good seaboat, rides out heavy weather easily

Tumblehome hull.

Belt and end armor belts cover 12 feet vertically. Belt armor is equivalent to 11.55 inches of vertical armor, end armor is equivalent to 4.62 inches of vertical armor.

Miscellaneous weight:
20 tons hull below water is for 6 x 18 inch torpedo tubes (2 fore, 2 aft, 1 each broadside) with 3 x 1,250 pound torpedoes each.
300 tons above deck reserve weight.

Quote from: Delta Force on December 08, 2012, 02:27:09 AM
I was toying around with this design and I think it is possible under the current rules (10 inch guns are not "big guns").

Uniform Battery Battleship, Russia Battleship laid down 1900[...]
      4 - 10.00" / 254 mm 45.0 cal guns - 500.01lbs / 226.80kg shells, 60 per gun
     Breech loading guns in turret on barbette mounts, 1900 Model
     2 x Twin mounts on centreline ends, evenly spread
      12 - 10.00" / 254 mm 45.0 cal guns - 500.01lbs / 226.80kg shells, 60 per gun
     Breech loading guns in turret on barbette mounts, 1900 Model
     6 x Twin mounts on sides, evenly spread
[...]

Seriously, NO.

And by the way, it's clearly illegal anyway. Ten inchers might not be "big guns", but neither are they small (if they were, you couldn't put them in turrets anyway). Instead they are defined as 8-10" medium-caliber guns are not secondaries, but medium-caliber main guns and as such the normal rules apply.

If you want a ship with that many gig guns, you have to put them in casemates. That would be legal, although it would still be against the spirit of the rules.

I agree with Nobody

Jef

I like the idea, but yeah what the other 2 already said... Now there are ways around that restriction that dont violate any rules.

Quote from: Nobody on December 08, 2012, 06:09:04 AM

-snipped for brevity-

If you want a ship with that many gig guns, you have to put them in casemates. That would be legal, although it would still be against the spirit of the rules.

So now... Japan designs a harbor defense floating battery with 10 10-inch casemated guns.....

I wasn't really planning on building anything like that for a few years anyways. It is an interesting concept though and something that might influence Russian dreadnought design. Perhaps a similar configuration will be seen on the first Russian battlecruisers or light dreadnoughts.

The Russian version of the American Pittsburgh class armored cruiser.

Minsk, Russia Armored Cruiser laid down 1900

Displacement:
   12,530 t light; 13,132 t standard; 14,558 t normal; 15,699 t full load

Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep)
   (555.00 ft / 555.00 ft) x 70.50 ft x (25.00 / 26.50 ft)
   (169.16 m / 169.16 m) x 21.49 m  x (7.62 / 8.08 m)

Armament:
      6 - 10.00" / 254 mm 45.0 cal guns - 500.01lbs / 226.80kg shells, 100 per gun
     Breech loading guns in turret on barbette mounts, 1900 Model
     3 x Twin mounts on centreline ends, majority aft
      6 - 6.00" / 152 mm 45.0 cal guns - 89.99lbs / 40.82kg shells, 200 per gun
     Quick firing guns in deck and hoist mounts, 1900 Model
     3 x Twin mounts on centreline ends, majority aft
      3 raised mounts
      8 - 6.00" / 152 mm 45.0 cal guns - 89.99lbs / 40.82kg shells, 150 per gun
     Quick firing guns in casemate mounts, 1900 Model
     8 x Single mounts on sides, evenly spread
      12 - 3.00" / 76.2 mm 50.0 cal guns - 11.99lbs / 5.44kg shells, 300 per gun
     Quick firing guns in deck mounts, 1900 Model
     12 x Single mounts on sides, evenly spread
      12 raised mounts
      Weight of broadside 4,404 lbs / 1,998 kg

Armour:
   - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   6.00" / 152 mm   394.05 ft / 120.11 m   13.00 ft / 3.96 m
   Ends:   4.00" / 102 mm   160.93 ft / 49.05 m   8.00 ft / 2.44 m
   Upper:   4.00" / 102 mm   300.00 ft / 91.44 m   8.00 ft / 2.44 m
     Main Belt covers 109 % of normal length

   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   6.00" / 152 mm   4.00" / 102 mm      6.00" / 152 mm
   2nd:   6.00" / 152 mm   4.00" / 102 mm            -
   3rd:   4.00" / 102 mm         -         4.00" / 102 mm

   - Armoured deck - single deck:
   For and Aft decks: 1.50" / 38 mm
   Forecastle: 1.50" / 38 mm  Quarter deck: 1.50" / 38 mm

   - Conning towers: Forward 10.00" / 254 mm, Aft 0.00" / 0 mm

Machinery:
   Coal fired boilers, complex reciprocating steam engines,
   Direct drive, 2 shafts, 23,895 ihp / 17,826 Kw = 21.50 kts
   Range 8,000nm at 10.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 2,568 tons (100% coal)

Complement:
   662 - 861

Cost:
   £1.357 million / $5.426 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 996 tons, 6.8 %
      - Guns: 996 tons, 6.8 %
   Armour: 3,380 tons, 23.2 %
      - Belts: 1,884 tons, 12.9 %
      - Armament: 624 tons, 4.3 %
      - Armour Deck: 744 tons, 5.1 %
      - Conning Tower: 128 tons, 0.9 %
   Machinery: 3,734 tons, 25.6 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 4,383 tons, 30.1 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 2,028 tons, 13.9 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 37 tons, 0.3 %
      - Hull below water: 12 tons
      - Above deck: 25 tons

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     12,915 lbs / 5,858 Kg = 25.8 x 10.0 " / 254 mm shells or 1.6 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.26
   Metacentric height 4.5 ft / 1.4 m
   Roll period: 14.0 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 75 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.51
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1.51

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has a flush deck,
     a normal bow and a cruiser stern
   Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0.521 / 0.530
   Length to Beam Ratio: 7.87 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 23.56 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 41 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 50
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 0.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
   Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length):
            Fore end,    Aft end
      - Forecastle:   17.00 %,  23.00 ft / 7.01 m,  18.00 ft / 5.49 m
      - Forward deck:   40.00 %,  18.00 ft / 5.49 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Aft deck:   31.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Quarter deck:   12.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Average freeboard:      17.08 ft / 5.21 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 108.3 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 126.7 %
   Waterplane Area: 26,575 Square feet or 2,469 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 99 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 123 lbs/sq ft or 600 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.96
      - Longitudinal: 1.37
      - Overall: 1.00
   Adequate machinery, storage, compartmentation space
   Excellent accommodation and workspace room
   Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
   Excellent seaboat, comfortable, can fire her guns in the heaviest weather

Below-decks miscellaneous weight accounts for 4 submerged broadside 18" 5m wet heater torpedo tubes and 8 reload torpedoes.

Above-decks miscellaneous weight allows for a long-range wireless installation.

kinda slow isnt it? when there are BBs in service that are only a knot slower (with superior armor and guns)

Revised design.

Minskv2, Russia Armored Cruiser laid down 1900

Displacement:
   13,300 t light; 13,918 t standard; 15,391 t normal; 16,569 t full load

Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep)
   (555.00 ft / 555.00 ft) x 70.50 ft x (25.00 / 26.51 ft)
   (169.16 m / 169.16 m) x 21.49 m  x (7.62 / 8.08 m)

Armament:
      6 - 10.00" / 254 mm 45.0 cal guns - 500.01lbs / 226.80kg shells, 100 per gun
     Breech loading guns in turret on barbette mounts, 1900 Model
     3 x Twin mounts on centreline ends, majority aft
      6 - 6.00" / 152 mm 45.0 cal guns - 89.99lbs / 40.82kg shells, 200 per gun
     Quick firing guns in deck and hoist mounts, 1900 Model
     3 x Twin mounts on centreline ends, majority aft
      3 raised mounts
      8 - 6.00" / 152 mm 45.0 cal guns - 89.99lbs / 40.82kg shells, 150 per gun
     Quick firing guns in casemate mounts, 1900 Model
     8 x Single mounts on sides, evenly spread
      12 - 3.00" / 76.2 mm 50.0 cal guns - 11.99lbs / 5.44kg shells, 300 per gun
     Quick firing guns in deck mounts, 1900 Model
     12 x Single mounts on sides, evenly spread
      12 raised mounts
      Weight of broadside 4,404 lbs / 1,998 kg

Armour:
   - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   6.00" / 152 mm   435.00 ft / 132.59 m   13.00 ft / 3.96 m
   Ends:   3.00" / 76 mm   119.00 ft / 36.27 m   8.00 ft / 2.44 m
     1.00 ft / 0.30 m Unarmoured ends
   Upper:   3.00" / 76 mm   300.00 ft / 91.44 m   8.00 ft / 2.44 m
     Main Belt covers 121 % of normal length

   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   6.00" / 152 mm   3.00" / 76 mm      6.00" / 152 mm
   2nd:   6.00" / 152 mm   3.00" / 76 mm            -
   3rd:   3.00" / 76 mm         -         3.00" / 76 mm

   - Armoured deck - single deck:
   For and Aft decks: 1.50" / 38 mm
   Forecastle: 1.50" / 38 mm  Quarter deck: 1.50" / 38 mm

   - Conning towers: Forward 10.00" / 254 mm, Aft 0.00" / 0 mm

Machinery:
   Coal fired boilers, complex reciprocating steam engines,
   Direct drive, 2 shafts, 29,400 ihp / 21,932 Kw = 22.47 kts
   Range 8,000nm at 10.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 2,651 tons (100% coal)

Complement:
   690 - 898

Cost:
   £1.504 million / $6.016 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 996 tons, 6.5 %
      - Guns: 996 tons, 6.5 %
   Armour: 3,256 tons, 21.2 %
      - Belts: 1,805 tons, 11.7 %
      - Armament: 553 tons, 3.6 %
      - Armour Deck: 765 tons, 5.0 %
      - Conning Tower: 133 tons, 0.9 %
   Machinery: 4,594 tons, 29.8 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 4,417 tons, 28.7 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 2,091 tons, 13.6 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 37 tons, 0.2 %
      - Hull below water: 12 tons
      - Above deck: 25 tons

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     11,172 lbs / 5,068 Kg = 22.3 x 10.0 " / 254 mm shells or 1.4 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.32
   Metacentric height 4.9 ft / 1.5 m
   Roll period: 13.4 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 76 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.48
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1.54

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has a flush deck,
     a normal bow and a cruiser stern
   Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0.551 / 0.559
   Length to Beam Ratio: 7.87 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 23.56 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 44 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 49
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 0.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
   Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length):
            Fore end,    Aft end
      - Forecastle:   17.00 %,  23.00 ft / 7.01 m,  18.00 ft / 5.49 m
      - Forward deck:   40.00 %,  18.00 ft / 5.49 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Aft deck:   31.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Quarter deck:   12.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Average freeboard:      17.08 ft / 5.21 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 120.4 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 124.9 %
   Waterplane Area: 27,325 Square feet or 2,539 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 95 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 121 lbs/sq ft or 591 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.96
      - Longitudinal: 1.33
      - Overall: 1.00
   Cramped machinery, storage, compartmentation space
   Excellent accommodation and workspace room
   Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
   Excellent seaboat, comfortable, can fire her guns in the heaviest weather

Below-decks miscellaneous weight accounts for 4 submerged broadside 18" 5m wet heater torpedo tubes and 8 reload torpedoes.

Above-decks miscellaneous weight allows for a long-range wireless installation.

These two ships are the final evolution of Russian pre-dreadnought and armored cruiser design. With minor variation (such as new engines or fuel) these two ships will be the only capital ships produced until the first IRN dreadnoughts and battlecruisers are built. I might also have a hybrid armored cruiser and battlecruiser design as well, as Russia did build ships based around that concept.

Semi-Dreadnought, Russia Battleship laid down 1902 (Engine 1900)

Displacement:
   16,000 t light; 16,714 t standard; 18,309 t normal; 19,585 t full load

Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep)
   (488.00 ft / 480.00 ft) x 74.00 ft (Bulges 80.00 ft) x (26.25 / 27.91 ft)
   (148.74 m / 146.30 m) x 22.56 m (Bulges 24.38 m)  x (8.00 / 8.51 m)

Armament:
      4 - 12.00" / 305 mm 40.0 cal guns - 749.99lbs / 340.19kg shells, 60 per gun
     Breech loading guns in turret on barbette mounts, 1902 Model
     2 x Twin mounts on centreline ends, evenly spread
      12 - 10.00" / 254 mm 45.0 cal guns - 500.01lbs / 226.80kg shells, 60 per gun
     Breech loading guns in turret on barbette mounts, 1902 Model
     6 x Twin mounts on sides, evenly spread
      12 - 3.00" / 76.2 mm 50.0 cal guns - 11.99lbs / 5.44kg shells, 360 per gun
     Breech loading guns in casemate mounts, 1902 Model
     12 x Single mounts on sides, evenly spread
      12 hull mounts in casemates- Limited use in heavy seas
      8 - 3.00" / 76.2 mm 50.0 cal guns - 11.99lbs / 5.44kg shells, 360 per gun
     Quick firing guns in deck mounts, 1902 Model
     8 x Single mounts on centreline ends, evenly spread
      8 raised mounts
      Weight of broadside 9,240 lbs / 4,191 kg

Armour:
   - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   12.0" / 305 mm   312.00 ft / 95.10 m   13.86 ft / 4.22 m
   Ends:   5.00" / 127 mm   168.00 ft / 51.21 m   13.86 ft / 4.22 m
   Upper:   5.00" / 127 mm   312.00 ft / 95.10 m   8.00 ft / 2.44 m
     Main Belt covers 100 % of normal length
     Main Belt inclined -30.00 degrees (positive = in)

   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   12.0" / 305 mm   5.00" / 127 mm      10.0" / 254 mm
   3rd:   6.00" / 152 mm   3.00" / 76 mm      6.00" / 152 mm
   4th:   3.00" / 76 mm         -               -
   5th:   1.00" / 25 mm         -               -

   - Armoured deck - single deck:
   For and Aft decks: 2.00" / 51 mm
   Forecastle: 2.00" / 51 mm  Quarter deck: 2.00" / 51 mm

   - Conning towers: Forward 10.00" / 254 mm, Aft 10.00" / 254 mm

Machinery:
   Coal fired boilers, complex reciprocating steam engines,
   Direct drive, 2 shafts, 17,520 ihp / 13,070 Kw = 18.61 kts
   Range 8,000nm at 10.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 2,872 tons (100% coal)

Complement:
   786 - 1,023

Cost:
   £1.800 million / $7.199 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 1,923 tons, 10.5 %
      - Guns: 1,923 tons, 10.5 %
   Armour: 6,001 tons, 32.8 %
      - Belts: 3,244 tons, 17.7 %
      - Armament: 1,455 tons, 7.9 %
      - Armour Deck: 1,002 tons, 5.5 %
      - Conning Towers: 299 tons, 1.6 %
   Machinery: 2,737 tons, 15.0 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 5,019 tons, 27.4 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 2,309 tons, 12.6 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 320 tons, 1.7 %
      - Hull below water: 20 tons
      - Above deck: 300 tons

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     18,544 lbs / 8,412 Kg = 21.5 x 12.0 " / 305 mm shells or 2.3 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.20
   Metacentric height 4.4 ft / 1.4 m
   Roll period: 15.9 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 75 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.68
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1.48

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has a flush deck,
     a ram bow and a cruiser stern
   Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0.636 / 0.640
   Length to Beam Ratio: 6.00 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 21.91 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 44 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 51
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): -10.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
   Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length):
            Fore end,    Aft end
      - Forecastle:   20.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Forward deck:   30.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Aft deck:   35.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Quarter deck:   15.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Average freeboard:      16.00 ft / 4.88 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 89.9 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 104.1 %
   Waterplane Area: 26,856 Square feet or 2,495 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 92 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 151 lbs/sq ft or 736 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.94
      - Longitudinal: 1.63
      - Overall: 1.00
   Adequate machinery, storage, compartmentation space
   Adequate accommodation and workspace room
   Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
   Good seaboat, rides out heavy weather easily

Tumblehome hull.

Belt and end armor belts cover 12 feet vertically. Belt armor is equivalent to 13.86 inches of vertical armor, end armor is equivalent to 5.77 inches of vertical armor.

Miscellaneous weight:
20 tons hull below water is for 6 x 18 inch torpedo tubes (2 fore, 2 aft, 1 each broadside) with 3 x 1,250 pound torpedoes each.
300 tons above deck reserve weight.

Semi-Dreadnought Battlecruiser, Russia Battleship laid down 1902 (Engine 1900)

Displacement:
   16,800 t light; 17,453 t standard; 19,099 t normal; 20,415 t full load

Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep)
   (508.00 ft / 500.00 ft) x 74.00 ft (Bulges 80.00 ft) x (26.25 / 27.90 ft)
   (154.84 m / 152.40 m) x 22.56 m (Bulges 24.38 m)  x (8.00 / 8.50 m)

Armament:
      4 - 12.00" / 305 mm 40.0 cal guns - 749.99lbs / 340.19kg shells, 60 per gun
     Breech loading guns in turret on barbette mounts, 1902 Model
     2 x Twin mounts on centreline ends, evenly spread
      8 - 10.00" / 254 mm 45.0 cal guns - 500.01lbs / 226.80kg shells, 60 per gun
     Breech loading guns in turret on barbette mounts, 1902 Model
     4 x Twin mounts on sides, evenly spread
      16 - 3.00" / 76.2 mm 50.0 cal guns - 11.99lbs / 5.44kg shells, 360 per gun
     Breech loading guns in casemate mounts, 1902 Model
     16 x Single mounts on sides, evenly spread
      12 hull mounts in casemates- Limited use in heavy seas
      Weight of broadside 7,192 lbs / 3,262 kg

Armour:
   - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   10.0" / 254 mm   376.00 ft / 114.60 m   13.86 ft / 4.22 m
   Ends:   4.00" / 102 mm   124.00 ft / 37.80 m   13.86 ft / 4.22 m
   Upper:   4.00" / 102 mm   376.00 ft / 114.60 m   8.00 ft / 2.44 m
     Main Belt covers 116 % of normal length
     Main Belt inclined -30.00 degrees (positive = in)

   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   10.0" / 254 mm   4.00" / 102 mm      8.00" / 203 mm
   3rd:   5.00" / 127 mm   2.00" / 51 mm      5.00" / 127 mm
   4th:   3.00" / 76 mm         -               -

   - Armoured deck - single deck:
   For and Aft decks: 1.50" / 38 mm
   Forecastle: 1.50" / 38 mm  Quarter deck: 1.50" / 38 mm

   - Conning towers: Forward 8.00" / 203 mm, Aft 8.00" / 203 mm

Machinery:
   Coal fired boilers, complex reciprocating steam engines,
   Direct drive, 2 shafts, 32,000 ihp / 23,872 Kw = 21.70 kts
   Range 8,000nm at 10.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 2,962 tons (100% coal)

Complement:
   812 - 1,056

Cost:
   £1.953 million / $7.811 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 1,461 tons, 7.7 %
      - Guns: 1,461 tons, 7.7 %
   Armour: 4,940 tons, 25.9 %
      - Belts: 2,955 tons, 15.5 %
      - Armament: 956 tons, 5.0 %
      - Armour Deck: 783 tons, 4.1 %
      - Conning Towers: 246 tons, 1.3 %
   Machinery: 5,000 tons, 26.2 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 5,078 tons, 26.6 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 2,299 tons, 12.0 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 320 tons, 1.7 %
      - Hull below water: 20 tons
      - Above deck: 300 tons

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     13,239 lbs / 6,005 Kg = 15.3 x 12.0 " / 305 mm shells or 1.7 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.24
   Metacentric height 4.7 ft / 1.4 m
   Roll period: 15.5 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 75 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.50
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1.22

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has a flush deck,
     a ram bow and a cruiser stern
   Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0.637 / 0.640
   Length to Beam Ratio: 6.25 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 22.36 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 51 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 62
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): -10.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
   Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length):
            Fore end,    Aft end
      - Forecastle:   20.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Forward deck:   30.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Aft deck:   35.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Quarter deck:   15.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Average freeboard:      16.00 ft / 4.88 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 115.5 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 105.1 %
   Waterplane Area: 27,998 Square feet or 2,601 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 88 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 140 lbs/sq ft or 685 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.95
      - Longitudinal: 1.48
      - Overall: 1.00
   Cramped machinery, storage, compartmentation space
   Adequate accommodation and workspace room
   Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
   Good seaboat, rides out heavy weather easily

Tumblehome hull.

Belt and end armor belts cover 12 feet vertically. Belt armor is equivalent to 11.55 inches of vertical armor, end armor is equivalent to 4.62 inches of vertical armor.

Miscellaneous weight:
20 tons hull below water is for 6 x 18 inch torpedo tubes (2 fore, 2 aft, 1 each broadside) with 3 x 1,250 pound torpedoes each.
300 tons above deck reserve weight.

Big and pretty scary, as long as the range is such that the 10" guns can be effective against the targets armor.  Upper belt is perhaps a bit light, and there's a gap between the top of the upper belt and the main deck.  Also, the deck armor on the battlecruiser is maybe a bit light, if it is expected to be shot at by heavy caliber guns.  3" anti-TB battery is fine as long as the TBs don't grow too large.

Your 2 classes had minor differences.
Built 1 class - 21kts BB

O boy, some big boys here. Well, while tumblehomes may be advantageous in ship cost they will have major disadvantages in combat. Might be something to keep in mind.

Quote from: Jefgte on January 03, 2013, 06:30:19 AM
Your 2 classes had minor differences.
Built 1 class - 21kts BB

That is probably a good idea, as the semi-dreadnought is too slow for the armored cruiser squadrons but faster than the pre-dreadnoughts. 21 knots is likely to be my standard speed for dreadnoughts and it will ensure the semi-dreadnoughts have other ships to operate with instead of occupying a narrow speed band between the pre-dreadnoughts and armored cruisers.

Quote from: snip on January 03, 2013, 10:20:36 AM
O boy, some big boys here. Well, while tumblehomes may be advantageous in ship cost they will have major disadvantages in combat. Might be something to keep in mind.

Tumblehome seems like a valid option during the transition to full dreadnoughts. They won't age as well as conventional ships due to their vulnerability to underwater damage and plunging fire, but against their contemporaries they have the advantage of sloped armor and better seakeeping (although many observers thought such ships were capsizing when they turned). Against other pre-dreadnoughts these ships should do fine, but I do plan to build conventional ships once the dreadnought era starts.

Here is the revised design, which I consider to be very high performance seeing as it is using coal fired reciprocating engines. When equipped with turbines the biggest limitation on speed is actually the stability of the design.

Semi-Dreadnoughtv2, Russia Battleship laid down 1902 (Engine 1900)

Displacement:
   18,800 t light; 19,566 t standard; 21,350 t normal; 22,777 t full load

Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep)
   (548.00 ft / 540.00 ft) x 74.00 ft (Bulges 80.00 ft) x (26.25 / 27.87 ft)
   (167.03 m / 164.59 m) x 22.56 m (Bulges 24.38 m)  x (8.00 / 8.49 m)

Armament:
      4 - 12.00" / 305 mm 45.0 cal guns - 750.00lbs / 340.19kg shells, 60 per gun
     Breech loading guns in turret on barbette mounts, 1902 Model
     2 x Twin mounts on centreline ends, evenly spread
      12 - 10.00" / 254 mm 45.0 cal guns - 500.01lbs / 226.80kg shells, 60 per gun
     Breech loading guns in turret on barbette mounts, 1902 Model
     6 x Twin mounts on sides, evenly spread
      16 - 3.00" / 76.2 mm 50.0 cal guns - 11.99lbs / 5.44kg shells, 360 per gun
     Breech loading guns in casemate mounts, 1902 Model
     4 x Single mounts on centreline ends, evenly spread
      4 raised mounts
     12 x Single mounts on sides, evenly spread
      12 raised mounts
      Weight of broadside 9,192 lbs / 4,169 kg

Armour:
   - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   10.0" / 254 mm   378.00 ft / 115.21 m   13.86 ft / 4.22 m
   Ends:   5.00" / 127 mm   162.00 ft / 49.38 m   13.86 ft / 4.22 m
   Upper:   5.00" / 127 mm   378.00 ft / 115.21 m   8.00 ft / 2.44 m
     Main Belt covers 108 % of normal length
     Main Belt inclined -30.00 degrees (positive = in)

   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   10.0" / 254 mm   5.00" / 127 mm      8.00" / 203 mm
   3rd:   6.00" / 152 mm   3.00" / 76 mm      6.00" / 152 mm
   4th:   3.00" / 76 mm         -               -

   - Armoured deck - single deck:
   For and Aft decks: 2.00" / 51 mm
   Forecastle: 2.00" / 51 mm  Quarter deck: 2.00" / 51 mm

   - Conning towers: Forward 10.00" / 254 mm, Aft 10.00" / 254 mm

Machinery:
   Coal fired boilers, complex reciprocating steam engines,
   Direct drive, 2 shafts, 29,500 ihp / 22,007 Kw = 21.01 kts
   Range 8,000nm at 10.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 3,212 tons (100% coal)

Complement:
   883 - 1,148

Cost:
   £2.207 million / $8.829 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 2,005 tons, 9.4 %
      - Guns: 2,005 tons, 9.4 %
   Armour: 6,134 tons, 28.7 %
      - Belts: 3,281 tons, 15.4 %
      - Armament: 1,370 tons, 6.4 %
      - Armour Deck: 1,151 tons, 5.4 %
      - Conning Towers: 332 tons, 1.6 %
   Machinery: 4,609 tons, 21.6 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 5,732 tons, 26.8 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 2,550 tons, 11.9 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 320 tons, 1.5 %
      - Hull below water: 20 tons
      - Above deck: 300 tons

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     16,612 lbs / 7,535 Kg = 19.2 x 12.0 " / 305 mm shells or 1.9 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.16
   Metacentric height 4.2 ft / 1.3 m
   Roll period: 16.4 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 76 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.67
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1.28

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has a flush deck,
     a ram bow and a cruiser stern
   Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0.659 / 0.662
   Length to Beam Ratio: 6.75 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 23.24 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 47 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 59
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): -10.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
   Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length):
            Fore end,    Aft end
      - Forecastle:   20.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Forward deck:   30.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Aft deck:   35.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Quarter deck:   15.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Average freeboard:      16.00 ft / 4.88 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 107.1 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 106.5 %
   Waterplane Area: 30,863 Square feet or 2,867 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 88 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 148 lbs/sq ft or 723 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.98
      - Longitudinal: 1.25
      - Overall: 1.00
   Adequate machinery, storage, compartmentation space
   Adequate accommodation and workspace room
   Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
   Good seaboat, rides out heavy weather easily

Tumblehome hull.

Belt and end armor belts cover 12 feet vertically. Belt armor is equivalent to 11.55 inches of vertical armor, end armor is equivalent to 5.77 inches of vertical armor.

Miscellaneous weight:
20 tons hull below water is for 6 x 18 inch torpedo tubes (2 fore, 2 aft, 1 each broadside) with 3 x 1,250 pound torpedoes each.
300 tons above deck reserve weight.

Well, the Incomparables are not so out of line after all...

Quote from: snip on January 03, 2013, 08:34:34 PM
Well, the Incomparables are not so out of line after all...

I will probably make it smaller and better armored and wait for turbines to get it up to 21 knots or higher.

Modified the armor arrangement further to offer improved protection. Getting past 18 or so knots with current engine technologies is simply too expensive for anything expected to hold up in the battleline.

Semi-Dreadnoughtv3, Russia Battleship laid down 1902 (Engine 1900)

Displacement:
   16,250 t light; 16,960 t standard; 18,568 t normal; 19,855 t full load

Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep)
   (478.00 ft / 470.00 ft) x 74.00 ft (Bulges 80.00 ft) x (26.25 / 27.93 ft)
   (145.69 m / 143.26 m) x 22.56 m (Bulges 24.38 m)  x (8.00 / 8.51 m)

Armament:
      4 - 12.00" / 305 mm 45.0 cal guns - 749.99lbs / 340.19kg shells, 60 per gun
     Breech loading guns in turret on barbette mounts, 1902 Model
     2 x Twin mounts on centreline ends, evenly spread
      12 - 10.00" / 254 mm 45.0 cal guns - 500.01lbs / 226.80kg shells, 60 per gun
     Breech loading guns in turret on barbette mounts, 1902 Model
     6 x Twin mounts on sides, evenly spread
      16 - 3.00" / 76.2 mm 50.0 cal guns - 11.99lbs / 5.44kg shells, 360 per gun
     Breech loading guns in casemate mounts, 1902 Model
     4 x Single mounts on centreline ends, evenly spread
      4 raised mounts
     12 x Single mounts on sides, evenly spread
      12 raised mounts
      Weight of broadside 9,192 lbs / 4,169 kg

Armour:
   - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   12.0" / 305 mm   304.00 ft / 92.66 m   13.86 ft / 4.22 m
   Ends:   6.00" / 152 mm   166.00 ft / 50.60 m   13.86 ft / 4.22 m
   Upper:   6.00" / 152 mm   304.00 ft / 92.66 m   8.00 ft / 2.44 m
     Main Belt covers 100 % of normal length
     Main Belt inclined -30.00 degrees (positive = in)

   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   12.0" / 305 mm   5.00" / 127 mm      10.0" / 254 mm
   3rd:   6.00" / 152 mm   3.00" / 76 mm      6.00" / 152 mm
   4th:   3.00" / 76 mm         -               -

   - Armoured deck - single deck:
   For and Aft decks: 2.50" / 64 mm
   Forecastle: 2.50" / 64 mm  Quarter deck: 2.50" / 64 mm

   - Conning towers: Forward 12.00" / 305 mm, Aft 12.00" / 305 mm

Machinery:
   Coal fired boilers, complex reciprocating steam engines,
   Direct drive, 2 shafts, 16,000 ihp / 11,936 Kw = 18.06 kts
   Range 8,000nm at 10.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 2,895 tons (100% coal)

Complement:
   794 - 1,033

Cost:
   £1.823 million / $7.290 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 2,005 tons, 10.8 %
      - Guns: 2,005 tons, 10.8 %
   Armour: 6,449 tons, 34.7 %
      - Belts: 3,380 tons, 18.2 %
      - Armament: 1,455 tons, 7.8 %
      - Armour Deck: 1,252 tons, 6.7 %
      - Conning Towers: 363 tons, 2.0 %
   Machinery: 2,500 tons, 13.5 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 4,975 tons, 26.8 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 2,318 tons, 12.5 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 320 tons, 1.7 %
      - Hull below water: 20 tons
      - Above deck: 300 tons

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     19,308 lbs / 8,758 Kg = 22.3 x 12.0 " / 305 mm shells or 2.4 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.18
   Metacentric height 4.3 ft / 1.3 m
   Roll period: 16.1 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 76 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.69
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1.48

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has a flush deck,
     a ram bow and a cruiser stern
   Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0.658 / 0.662
   Length to Beam Ratio: 5.88 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 21.68 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 44 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 51
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): -10.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
   Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length):
            Fore end,    Aft end
      - Forecastle:   20.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Forward deck:   30.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Aft deck:   35.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Quarter deck:   15.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Average freeboard:      16.00 ft / 4.88 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 86.6 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 103.1 %
   Waterplane Area: 26,850 Square feet or 2,494 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 91 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 151 lbs/sq ft or 737 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.94
      - Longitudinal: 1.66
      - Overall: 1.00
   Adequate machinery, storage, compartmentation space
   Adequate accommodation and workspace room
   Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
   Good seaboat, rides out heavy weather easily

Tumblehome hull.

Belt and end armor belts cover 12 feet vertically. Belt armor is equivalent to 11.55 inches of vertical armor, end armor is equivalent to 5.77 inches of vertical armor.

Miscellaneous weight:
20 tons hull below water is for 6 x 18 inch torpedo tubes (2 fore, 2 aft, 1 each broadside) with 3 x 1,250 pound torpedoes each.
300 tons above deck reserve weight.

> Belt and end armor belts cover 12 feet vertically. Belt armor is equivalent to 11.55 inches of vertical
> armor, end armor is equivalent to 5.77 inches of vertical armor.

I don't think this section is right, since both belts are thicker than that.

Quote from: KWorld on January 04, 2013, 02:05:10 AM
> Belt and end armor belts cover 12 feet vertically. Belt armor is equivalent to 11.55 inches of vertical
> armor, end armor is equivalent to 5.77 inches of vertical armor.

I don't think this section is right, since both belts are thicker than that.

You're right, I forgot to change that after increasing the armor from 10 and 5 inches. It should be equivalent to 13.86 and 5.77 inches.

Quote from: Delta Force on January 04, 2013, 03:53:36 PM

Quote from: KWorld on January 04, 2013, 02:05:10 AM
> Belt and end armor belts cover 12 feet vertically. Belt armor is equivalent to 11.55 inches of vertical
> armor, end armor is equivalent to 5.77 inches of vertical armor.

I don't think this section is right, since both belts are thicker than that.

You're right, I forgot to change that after increasing the armor from 10 and 5 inches. It should be equivalent to 13.86 and 5.77 inches.

The upper and end belts are 6"....

Quote from: KWorld on January 04, 2013, 04:12:47 PM

Quote from: Delta Force on January 04, 2013, 03:53:36 PM

Quote from: KWorld on January 04, 2013, 02:05:10 AM
> Belt and end armor belts cover 12 feet vertically. Belt armor is equivalent to 11.55 inches of vertical
> armor, end armor is equivalent to 5.77 inches of vertical armor.

I don't think this section is right, since both belts are thicker than that.

You're right, I forgot to change that after increasing the armor from 10 and 5 inches. It should be equivalent to 13.86 and 5.77 inches.

The upper and end belts are 6"....

Forgot I increased those to 6 inches. 6 inches at a 30 degree incline is equal to 6.93 inches of vertical armor.

A new coastal defense battleship for IRN Baltic and Black Sea service. I'm not sure how deep the waters are off the Baltic coastline, but the ship is rather low draught.

Coastal Battleship, Russia Coastal Battleship laid down 1900

Displacement:
   7,850 t light; 8,216 t standard; 8,753 t normal; 9,183 t full load

Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep)
   (368.00 ft / 360.00 ft) x 66.00 ft (Bulges 72.00 ft) x (18.17 / 18.99 ft)
   (112.17 m / 109.73 m) x 20.12 m (Bulges 21.95 m)  x (5.54 / 5.79 m)

Armament:
      4 - 12.00" / 305 mm 40.0 cal guns - 749.99lbs / 340.19kg shells, 60 per gun
     Breech loading guns in turret on barbette mounts, 1900 Model
     2 x Single mounts on sides amidships
      8 - 6.00" / 152 mm 45.0 cal guns - 89.99lbs / 40.82kg shells, 180 per gun
     Quick firing guns in casemate mounts, 1900 Model
     8 x Single mounts on sides, evenly spread
      8 - 3.00" / 76.2 mm 50.0 cal guns - 11.99lbs / 5.44kg shells, 360 per gun
     Quick firing guns in deck mounts, 1900 Model
     8 x Single mounts on centreline ends, evenly spread
      8 raised mounts
      Weight of broadside 3,816 lbs / 1,731 kg

Armour:
   - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   10.0" / 254 mm   234.00 ft / 71.32 m   9.24 ft / 2.82 m
   Ends:   5.00" / 127 mm   126.00 ft / 38.40 m   9.24 ft / 2.82 m
   Upper:   5.00" / 127 mm   234.00 ft / 71.32 m   8.00 ft / 2.44 m
     Main Belt covers 100 % of normal length
     Main Belt inclined -30.00 degrees (positive = in)

   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   12.0" / 305 mm   5.00" / 127 mm      10.0" / 254 mm
   2nd:   3.00" / 76 mm         -               -
   3rd:   1.00" / 25 mm         -               -

   - Armoured deck - single deck:
   For and Aft decks: 2.00" / 51 mm
   Forecastle: 2.00" / 51 mm  Quarter deck: 2.00" / 51 mm

   - Conning towers: Forward 12.00" / 305 mm, Aft 12.00" / 305 mm

Machinery:
   Coal fired boilers, complex reciprocating steam engines,
   Direct drive, 2 shafts, 9,266 ihp / 6,912 Kw = 17.16 kts
   Range 4,000nm at 10.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 967 tons (100% coal)

Complement:
   452 - 588

Cost:
   £0.800 million / $3.199 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 816 tons, 9.3 %
      - Guns: 816 tons, 9.3 %
   Armour: 3,075 tons, 35.1 %
      - Belts: 1,612 tons, 18.4 %
      - Armament: 564 tons, 6.4 %
      - Armour Deck: 679 tons, 7.8 %
      - Conning Towers: 220 tons, 2.5 %
   Machinery: 1,448 tons, 16.5 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 2,466 tons, 28.2 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 903 tons, 10.3 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 45 tons, 0.5 %
      - Hull below water: 20 tons
      - Above deck: 25 tons

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     9,994 lbs / 4,533 Kg = 11.6 x 12.0 " / 305 mm shells or 1.8 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.35
   Metacentric height 4.6 ft / 1.4 m
   Roll period: 14.1 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 76 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.31
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1.21

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has a flush deck,
     a ram bow and a cruiser stern
   Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0.651 / 0.653
   Length to Beam Ratio: 5.00 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 18.97 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 49 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 63
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): -10.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
   Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length):
            Fore end,    Aft end
      - Forecastle:   20.00 %,  12.00 ft / 3.66 m,  12.00 ft / 3.66 m
      - Forward deck:   30.00 %,  12.00 ft / 3.66 m,  12.00 ft / 3.66 m
      - Aft deck:   35.00 %,  12.00 ft / 3.66 m,  12.00 ft / 3.66 m
      - Quarter deck:   15.00 %,  12.00 ft / 3.66 m,  12.00 ft / 3.66 m
      - Average freeboard:      12.00 ft / 3.66 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 87.3 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 92.1 %
   Waterplane Area: 18,212 Square feet or 1,692 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 96 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 118 lbs/sq ft or 578 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.95
      - Longitudinal: 1.60
      - Overall: 1.00
   Adequate machinery, storage, compartmentation space
   Adequate accommodation and workspace room
   Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
   Good seaboat, rides out heavy weather easily

Tumblehome hull.

Belt and end armor belts cover 8 feet vertically. Belt armor is equivalent to 11.55 inches of vertical armor, end armor is equivalent to 5.77 inches of vertical armor.

Main armament mounted en echelon.

Miscellaneous weight:
20 tons hull below water is for 6 x 18 inch torpedo tubes (2 fore, 2 aft, 1 each broadside) with 3 x 1,250 pound torpedoes each.
11 tons above deck reserve weight.

> 4 - 12.00" / 305 mm 40.0 cal guns - 749.99lbs / 340.19kg shells, 60 per gun
>      Breech loading guns in turret on barbette mounts, 1900 Model
>     2 x Single mounts on sides amidships

There's an error here.....


Also, why go with the en echelon mountings, when they will cause problems with blast effects and limited cross-deck arcs that can be avoided with end mountings?  The end-on fire advantages are marginal, and the rest of the ship doesn't seem designed for end-on fire......

I agree with your question on the choice of echelon for the layout.  Unless like me he is just doing it for flavor, like I atempted to do...

Quote from: Tanthalas on January 08, 2013, 11:56:34 AM
I agree with your question on the choice of echelon for the layout.  Unless like me he is just doing it for flavor, like I atempted to do...

En echelon, in addition to end mountings, makes a fair amount of sense before superfiring mounts are available: increases broadside firepower on less tonnage than a full set of wing turrets.  En echelon mounts instead of end mountings, by this time period....... not so much.

Quote from: KWorld on January 08, 2013, 11:42:00 AM
> 4 - 12.00" / 305 mm 40.0 cal guns - 749.99lbs / 340.19kg shells, 60 per gun
>      Breech loading guns in turret on barbette mounts, 1900 Model
>     2 x Single mounts on sides amidships

There's an error here.....


Also, why go with the en echelon mountings, when they will cause problems with blast effects and limited cross-deck arcs that can be avoided with end mountings?  The end-on fire advantages are marginal, and the rest of the ship doesn't seem designed for end-on fire......

The Russians had a few en echelon battleships for service on the Black Sea to help force the Turkish Straits. Otherwise all IRN ships were designed for broadside combat, the Russians delayed in adopting superfiring turrets for their dreadnoughts because they thought it added too much weight and complexity for the advantages it gave in end on fire.

I was considering doing a design with four turrets (easily done on tumblehome hulls and one the reasons the French adopted them), but it is also vulnerable to blast damage and I am unsure if wing turrets are banned for pre-dreadnoughts with only four main guns. That's why I accidentally ended up with the single turrets.

It's easy to come up with new designs for the other ships, but I'm kind of stuck on how to improve or play around with the battleships while keeping with the pre-dreadnought and semi-dreadnought design. I've already done heavy casemates and stacked turrets and I'm not sure how else to experiment with battleships or even really improve the Borodino design. Is it common in Navalism to occasionally end up simply producing improved versions of old ships, similar to the British practice with early generation dreadnoughts?

Quote from: Delta Force on February 16, 2013, 02:33:43 AM
It's easy to come up with new designs for the other ships, but I'm kind of stuck on how to improve or play around with the battleships while keeping with the pre-dreadnought and semi-dreadnought design. I've already done heavy casemates and stacked turrets and I'm not sure how else to experiment with battleships or even really improve the Borodino design. Is it common in Navalism to occasionally end up simply producing improved versions of old ships, similar to the British practice with early generation dreadnoughts?

That's certainly along the lines that I'm planning for the USN, barring a war that shows that something they've done won't work.  The initial design of stacked turrets will be discovered to have flaws, those flaws will be fixed, but by the time any third generation would be on the boards they'll likely be replaced by early dreadnoughts.

thats esentialy what im doing, I didnt make any real changes other than switching from 8"-9.2" for the secondaries and upgrading the main guns to L45s on my REs

Quote from: KWorld on February 16, 2013, 04:29:52 AM

Quote from: Delta Force on February 16, 2013, 02:33:43 AM
It's easy to come up with new designs for the other ships, but I'm kind of stuck on how to improve or play around with the battleships while keeping with the pre-dreadnought and semi-dreadnought design. I've already done heavy casemates and stacked turrets and I'm not sure how else to experiment with battleships or even really improve the Borodino design. Is it common in Navalism to occasionally end up simply producing improved versions of old ships, similar to the British practice with early generation dreadnoughts?

That's certainly along the lines that I'm planning for the USN, barring a war that shows that something they've done won't work.  The initial design of stacked turrets will be discovered to have flaws, those flaws will be fixed, but by the time any third generation would be on the boards they'll likely be replaced by early dreadnoughts.

The one "innnovation" the USN is looking at is a small armored cruiser, armed with the in-development 7"/45, probably in twin turrets.  This design would be larger than the current protected cruisers, but smaller than even the older USS New York class ACs (let alone the new Pittsburghs or Salt Lake Citiys).  It would probably be an armored cruiser design, rather than a protected cruiser, with the advent of mixed-firing boilers in the near future.

[It's not really an innovation, the MN has been building some turret-equipped smallish protected cruisers.]

I'm not sure how large of an issue the high recoil is with this design, seeing as the ship doesn't use superfiring turrets anyways.

First Generation Dreadnought, Russia Battleship laid down 1907 (Engine 1905)

Displacement:
   13,320 t light; 13,981 t standard; 15,140 t normal; 16,068 t full load

Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep)
   (440.00 ft / 440.00 ft) x 74.00 ft x (26.25 / 27.59 ft)
   (134.11 m / 134.11 m) x 22.56 m  x (8.00 / 8.41 m)

Armament:
      12 - 12.00" / 305 mm 45.0 cal guns - 749.99lbs / 340.19kg shells, 60 per gun
     Breech loading guns in turret on barbette mounts, 1907 Model
     4 x Triple mounts on centreline ends, evenly spread
      16 - 3.00" / 76.2 mm 50.0 cal guns - 11.99lbs / 5.44kg shells, 360 per gun
     Breech loading guns in casemate mounts, 1907 Model
     16 x Single mounts on sides, evenly spread
      12 hull mounts in casemates- Limited use in heavy seas
      8 - 3.00" / 76.2 mm 50.0 cal guns - 11.99lbs / 5.44kg shells, 360 per gun
     Quick firing guns in deck mounts, 1907 Model
     8 x Single mounts on centreline ends, evenly spread
      8 raised mounts
      Weight of broadside 9,288 lbs / 4,213 kg

Armour:
   - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   12.0" / 305 mm   286.00 ft / 87.17 m   12.00 ft / 3.66 m
   Ends:   5.00" / 127 mm   154.00 ft / 46.94 m   12.00 ft / 3.66 m
   Upper:   5.00" / 127 mm   286.00 ft / 87.17 m   8.00 ft / 2.44 m
     Main Belt covers 100 % of normal length

   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   12.0" / 305 mm   5.00" / 127 mm      10.0" / 254 mm
   4th:   3.00" / 76 mm         -               -
   5th:   1.00" / 25 mm         -               -

   - Armoured deck - single deck:
   For and Aft decks: 2.00" / 51 mm
   Forecastle: 2.00" / 51 mm  Quarter deck: 2.00" / 51 mm

   - Conning towers: Forward 10.00" / 254 mm, Aft 10.00" / 254 mm

Machinery:
   Oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
   Direct drive, 3 shafts, 14,000 shp / 10,444 Kw = 18.01 kts
   Range 8,000nm at 10.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 2,088 tons

Complement:
   682 - 887

Cost:
   £1.610 million / $6.439 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 1,925 tons, 12.7 %
      - Guns: 1,925 tons, 12.7 %
   Armour: 5,339 tons, 35.3 %
      - Belts: 2,675 tons, 17.7 %
      - Armament: 1,495 tons, 9.9 %
      - Armour Deck: 905 tons, 6.0 %
      - Conning Towers: 264 tons, 1.7 %
   Machinery: 1,061 tons, 7.0 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 4,676 tons, 30.9 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 1,820 tons, 12.0 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 320 tons, 2.1 %
      - Hull below water: 20 tons
      - Above deck: 300 tons

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     16,971 lbs / 7,698 Kg = 19.6 x 12.0 " / 305 mm shells or 2.3 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.08
   Metacentric height 3.7 ft / 1.1 m
   Roll period: 16.1 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 74 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 1.00
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1.50

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has a flush deck,
     a ram bow and a cruiser stern
   Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0.620 / 0.626
   Length to Beam Ratio: 5.95 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 20.98 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 45 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 49
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): -10.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
   Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length):
            Fore end,    Aft end
      - Forecastle:   20.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Forward deck:   30.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Aft deck:   35.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Quarter deck:   15.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Average freeboard:      16.00 ft / 4.88 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 80.4 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 108.4 %
   Waterplane Area: 24,262 Square feet or 2,254 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 88 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 155 lbs/sq ft or 758 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.93
      - Longitudinal: 2.08
      - Overall: 1.01
   Excellent machinery, storage, compartmentation space
   Adequate accommodation and workspace room
   Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
   Excellent seaboat, comfortable, can fire her guns in the heaviest weather

Miscellaneous weight:
20 tons hull below water is for 6 x 18 inch torpedo tubes (2 fore, 2 aft, 1 each broadside) with 3 x 1,250 pound torpedoes each.
300 tons above deck reserve weight.

it isnt bad, the Recoil is a bit of an issue (at a 1.00 you would be restricted to end on fire only and take any damage you couldnt even do that), and the earliest you could realisticly lay it down would be like 1909 (a tripple turret takes 18 months or 3 turns to develop)

I'd be a bit worried about whether 3" guns would be enough to stop the increasingly large TBDs that you'd be facing by the time it's in service.  I'd go with at least 4" guns for secondaries if not larger (3" as tertiaries are fine, but too small IMO as secondaries).

Russia may construct a few dreadnought armored cruisers, ships with a more balanced approach to firepower, armor, and speed than the dreadnoughts and battlecruisers. Russia's geography doesn't really favor battlecruisers anyways, except in the Pacific, as the Baltic and Black Seas are rather constrained locations for 25 knot battlelines to be fighting.

Dreadnought Armored Cruiser, Russia Armored Cruiser laid down 1907 (Engine 1905)

Displacement:
   13,750 t light; 14,273 t standard; 15,488 t normal; 16,460 t full load

Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep)
   (540.00 ft / 540.00 ft) x 76.00 ft x (24.00 / 25.19 ft)
   (164.59 m / 164.59 m) x 23.16 m  x (7.32 / 7.68 m)

Armament:
      8 - 10.00" / 254 mm 50.0 cal guns - 500.01lbs / 226.80kg shells, 60 per gun
     Breech loading guns in turret on barbette mounts, 1907 Model
     4 x Twin mounts on centreline ends, evenly spread
      2 raised mounts - superfiring
      16 - 4.72" / 120 mm 50.0 cal guns - 50.00lbs / 22.68kg shells, 180 per gun
     Breech loading guns in casemate mounts, 1907 Model
     16 x Single mounts on sides, evenly spread
      16 hull mounts in casemates- Limited use in heavy seas
      Weight of broadside 4,800 lbs / 2,177 kg

Armour:
   - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   10.0" / 254 mm   352.00 ft / 107.29 m   12.00 ft / 3.66 m
   Ends:   4.00" / 102 mm   188.00 ft / 57.30 m   12.00 ft / 3.66 m
   Upper:   4.00" / 102 mm   352.00 ft / 107.29 m   8.00 ft / 2.44 m
     Main Belt covers 100 % of normal length

   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   10.0" / 254 mm   4.00" / 102 mm      8.00" / 203 mm
   4th:   3.00" / 76 mm         -               -

   - Armoured deck - single deck:
   For and Aft decks: 2.00" / 51 mm
   Forecastle: 1.50" / 38 mm  Quarter deck: 1.50" / 38 mm

   - Conning towers: Forward 10.00" / 254 mm, Aft 10.00" / 254 mm

Machinery:
   Oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
   Direct drive, 3 shafts, 34,650 shp / 25,849 Kw = 23.30 kts
   Range 8,000nm at 10.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 2,187 tons

Complement:
   693 - 902

Cost:
   £1.336 million / $5.344 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 1,196 tons, 7.7 %
      - Guns: 1,196 tons, 7.7 %
   Armour: 4,852 tons, 31.3 %
      - Belts: 2,624 tons, 16.9 %
      - Armament: 941 tons, 6.1 %
      - Armour Deck: 1,019 tons, 6.6 %
      - Conning Towers: 268 tons, 1.7 %
   Machinery: 2,625 tons, 16.9 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 4,756 tons, 30.7 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 1,738 tons, 11.2 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 320 tons, 2.1 %
      - Hull below water: 20 tons
      - Above deck: 300 tons

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     17,703 lbs / 8,030 Kg = 35.4 x 10.0 " / 254 mm shells or 2.4 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.07
   Metacentric height 3.8 ft / 1.2 m
   Roll period: 16.4 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 75 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.56
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1.23

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has a flush deck,
     a ram bow and a cruiser stern
   Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0.550 / 0.557
   Length to Beam Ratio: 7.11 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 23.24 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 48 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 61
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): -10.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
   Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length):
            Fore end,    Aft end
      - Forecastle:   20.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Forward deck:   30.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Aft deck:   35.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Quarter deck:   15.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Average freeboard:      16.00 ft / 4.88 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 83.3 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 126.0 %
   Waterplane Area: 28,651 Square feet or 2,662 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 103 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 133 lbs/sq ft or 649 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.97
      - Longitudinal: 1.29
      - Overall: 1.00
   Excellent machinery, storage, compartmentation space
   Excellent accommodation and workspace room
   Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
   Good seaboat, rides out heavy weather easily

Miscellaneous weight:
20 tons hull below water is for 6 x 18 inch torpedo tubes (2 fore, 2 aft, 1 each broadside) with 3 x 1,250 pound torpedoes each.
300 tons above deck reserve weight.

I'm considering a pair of battlecruisers for Pacific service. Given the rigors of Pacific service the ships are essentially the Bismarcks of the era, capable of fighting other capital ships just as well as prowling the oceans for weeks as a powerful commerce raider. They can thus tie down a vast portion of an enemy fleet in a hunt across the world's oceans, outfighting any cruisers, outrunning any battleships, and outlasting any pursuing battlecruisers. These would be perfect ships for a combination of triple expansion and turbine engines, but I'm not sure how to properly simulate that in game (it would most likely be year 1905 turbines with year 1909 triple expansion engines).

Gigant Class Battlecruiser, Russia Battlecruiser laid down 1907 (Engine 1909)

Displacement:
   16,550 t light; 17,246 t standard; 18,802 t normal; 20,046 t full load

Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep)
   (540.00 ft / 540.00 ft) x 80.00 ft x (24.00 / 25.33 ft)
   (164.59 m / 164.59 m) x 24.38 m  x (7.32 / 7.72 m)

Armament:
      8 - 10.00" / 254 mm 50.0 cal guns - 500.01lbs / 226.80kg shells, 90 per gun
     Breech loading guns in turret on barbette mounts, 1907 Model
     4 x Twin mounts on centreline ends, evenly spread
      16 - 4.72" / 120 mm 45.0 cal guns - 50.00lbs / 22.68kg shells, 270 per gun
     Breech loading guns in casemate mounts, 1907 Model
     16 x Single mounts on sides, evenly spread
      16 hull mounts in casemates- Limited use in heavy seas
      Weight of broadside 4,800 lbs / 2,177 kg

Armour:
   - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   12.0" / 305 mm   352.00 ft / 107.29 m   12.00 ft / 3.66 m
   Ends:   4.00" / 102 mm   188.00 ft / 57.30 m   12.00 ft / 3.66 m
   Upper:   4.00" / 102 mm   352.00 ft / 107.29 m   8.00 ft / 2.44 m
     Main Belt covers 100 % of normal length

   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   12.0" / 305 mm   5.00" / 127 mm      10.0" / 254 mm
   4th:   3.00" / 76 mm         -               -

   - Armoured deck - single deck:
   For and Aft decks: 2.00" / 51 mm
   Forecastle: 2.00" / 51 mm  Quarter deck: 2.00" / 51 mm

   - Conning towers: Forward 10.00" / 254 mm, Aft 10.00" / 254 mm

Machinery:
   Oil fired boilers, complex reciprocating steam engines,
   Direct drive, 3 shafts, 58,140 ihp / 43,373 Kw = 25.49 kts
   Range 12,000nm at 10.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 2,800 tons

Complement:
   802 - 1,043

Cost:
   £1.629 million / $6.516 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 1,175 tons, 6.2 %
      - Guns: 1,175 tons, 6.2 %
   Armour: 5,704 tons, 30.3 %
      - Belts: 3,029 tons, 16.1 %
      - Armament: 1,154 tons, 6.1 %
      - Armour Deck: 1,217 tons, 6.5 %
      - Conning Towers: 305 tons, 1.6 %
   Machinery: 4,066 tons, 21.6 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 5,285 tons, 28.1 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 2,251 tons, 12.0 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 320 tons, 1.7 %
      - Hull below water: 20 tons
      - Above deck: 300 tons

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     20,772 lbs / 9,422 Kg = 41.5 x 10.0 " / 254 mm shells or 2.2 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.15
   Metacentric height 4.7 ft / 1.4 m
   Roll period: 15.6 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 75 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.41
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1.14

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has a flush deck,
     a ram bow and a cruiser stern
   Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0.635 / 0.641
   Length to Beam Ratio: 6.75 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 23.24 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 56 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 66
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): -10.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
   Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length):
            Fore end,    Aft end
      - Forecastle:   20.00 %,  26.00 ft / 7.92 m,  22.00 ft / 6.71 m
      - Forward deck:   30.00 %,  22.00 ft / 6.71 m,  18.00 ft / 5.49 m
      - Aft deck:   35.00 %,  18.00 ft / 5.49 m,  18.00 ft / 5.49 m
      - Quarter deck:   15.00 %,  18.00 ft / 5.49 m,  18.00 ft / 5.49 m
      - Average freeboard:      19.72 ft / 6.01 m

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 93.8 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 146.7 %
   Waterplane Area: 32,631 Square feet or 3,032 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 100 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 128 lbs/sq ft or 623 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.96
      - Longitudinal: 1.44
      - Overall: 1.00
   Adequate machinery, storage, compartmentation space
   Excellent accommodation and workspace room
   Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform

Miscellaneous weight:
20 tons hull below water is for 6 x 18 inch torpedo tubes (2 fore, 2 aft, 1 each broadside) with 3 x 1,250 pound torpedoes each.
300 tons above deck reserve weight.

My revised first generation dreadnought, which is actually lighter than my existing semi-dreadnoughts.

First Generation Dreadnoughtv2, Russia Battleship laid down 1907 (Engine 1909)

Displacement:
   12,650 t light; 13,293 t standard; 14,163 t normal; 14,859 t full load

Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep)
   (440.00 ft / 440.00 ft) x 74.00 ft x (24.00 / 24.99 ft)
   (134.11 m / 134.11 m) x 22.56 m  x (7.32 / 7.62 m)

Armament:
      8 - 12.00" / 305 mm 45.0 cal guns - 749.99lbs / 340.19kg shells, 60 per gun
     Breech loading guns in turret on barbette mounts, 1907 Model
     4 x Twin mounts on centreline ends, evenly spread
      16 - 4.72" / 120 mm 45.0 cal guns - 50.00lbs / 22.68kg shells, 360 per gun
     Breech loading guns in casemate mounts, 1907 Model
     16 x Single mounts on sides, evenly spread
      12 hull mounts in casemates- Limited use in heavy seas
      Weight of broadside 6,800 lbs / 3,084 kg

Armour:
   - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   12.0" / 305 mm   286.00 ft / 87.17 m   12.00 ft / 3.66 m
   Ends:   5.00" / 127 mm   154.00 ft / 46.94 m   12.00 ft / 3.66 m
   Upper:   5.00" / 127 mm   286.00 ft / 87.17 m   8.00 ft / 2.44 m
     Main Belt covers 100 % of normal length

   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   12.0" / 305 mm   5.00" / 127 mm      10.0" / 254 mm
   4th:   3.00" / 76 mm         -               -

   - Armoured deck - single deck:
   For and Aft decks: 2.00" / 51 mm
   Forecastle: 2.00" / 51 mm  Quarter deck: 2.00" / 51 mm

   - Conning towers: Forward 10.00" / 254 mm, Aft 10.00" / 254 mm

Machinery:
   Oil fired boilers, complex reciprocating steam engines,
   Direct drive, 3 shafts, 24,660 ihp / 18,396 Kw = 21.00 kts
   Range 8,000nm at 10.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 1,566 tons

Complement:
   648 - 843

Cost:
   £1.375 million / $5.502 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 1,369 tons, 9.7 %
      - Guns: 1,369 tons, 9.7 %
   Armour: 5,070 tons, 35.8 %
      - Belts: 2,680 tons, 18.9 %
      - Armament: 1,221 tons, 8.6 %
      - Armour Deck: 917 tons, 6.5 %
      - Conning Towers: 252 tons, 1.8 %
   Machinery: 1,724 tons, 12.2 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 4,166 tons, 29.4 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 1,513 tons, 10.7 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 320 tons, 2.3 %
      - Hull below water: 20 tons
      - Above deck: 300 tons

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     16,475 lbs / 7,473 Kg = 19.1 x 12.0 " / 305 mm shells or 2.2 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.18
   Metacentric height 4.3 ft / 1.3 m
   Roll period: 14.9 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 57 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.59
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1.15

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has a flush deck,
     a ram bow and a cruiser stern
   Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0.634 / 0.639
   Length to Beam Ratio: 5.95 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 20.98 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 53 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 50
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): -10.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
   Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length):
            Fore end,    Aft end
      - Forecastle:   20.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Forward deck:   30.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Aft deck:   35.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Quarter deck:   15.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Average freeboard:      16.00 ft / 4.88 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 83.4 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 115.6 %
   Waterplane Area: 24,586 Square feet or 2,284 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 92 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 137 lbs/sq ft or 667 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.93
      - Longitudinal: 1.80
      - Overall: 1.00
   Adequate machinery, storage, compartmentation space
   Adequate accommodation and workspace room

Miscellaneous weight:
20 tons hull below water is for 6 x 18 inch torpedo tubes (2 fore, 2 aft, 1 each broadside) with 3 x 1,250 pound torpedoes each.
300 tons above deck reserve weight.

Well, it would help if we get to 1907 first. Things may be different then you expect tech wise.

Quote from: snip on February 27, 2013, 02:08:00 AM
Well, it would help if we get to 1907 first. Things may be different then you expect tech wise.

Now that I've read the rules in depth it seems more likely that the ships will be a 1908 or even (for the superfiring ships) 1909 project. What do you think about the general concepts though?

On the 1st generation DN, if they're intended for the Black Sea or the Baltic, their low seakeeping is OK.  If they're intended for the Pacific or a Northern fleet, you may need to raise the freeboard a bit.  Also, I'm not sure about the "ends but no superfiring" layout of the main battery.  It will certainly work, but you might be able to make better use of space by moving one turret behind the bridge (barrels over the forward boiler room).

The BC reminds me of my Montana designs, though it carries better armor than they do.

Not sure about the AC design, the speed benefit is awfully low for the price you're paying vs the 1st gen DN.

So what about the issue of engine type? Are reciprocating engines more demanding of maintenance than turbines or are the maintenance issues and loss of speed associated with reciprocating engines simply due to the burning of coal instead of oil? Would an oil burning reciprocating engine be more reliable?

the issue for most countries is going to be that if you keep developing VTEs your going to short yourself somewhere else (not somthing I object to honestly).  the VTE tech and the Turbine tech are obviously seperate (for various reasons).

as to the reliability of the types, Turbines allow for greater speed at lower weight with similar maintnence requirements because they are so much more eficient (not in terms of fuel but in terms of design) there is just alot less to go wrong with them (other than worries about a blade coming off and making life exciting)

Quote from: Delta Force on February 27, 2013, 01:15:32 PM
So what about the issue of engine type? Are reciprocating engines more demanding of maintenance than turbines or are the maintenance issues and loss of speed associated with reciprocating engines simply due to the burning of coal instead of oil? Would an oil burning reciprocating engine be more reliable?

Quote from: Delta Force on February 27, 2013, 01:15:32 PM
So what about the issue of engine type? Are reciprocating engines more demanding of maintenance than turbines or are the maintenance issues and loss of speed associated with reciprocating engines simply due to the burning of coal instead of oil? Would an oil burning reciprocating engine be more reliable?

If you want to build a ship that can roam around the world almost indefinitely, that should be one with an reciprocating engine until you switch to diesels in the 1930s or later. Any more or less skilled mechanic can build or repair a steam engine, but if you have a turbine you're screwed without a special factory (see the end SMS Dresden).
A turbine might be simpler in construction, but you can't just repair them without some serious equipment.

Coal can be quite troublesome in itself. Every couple hours at most, you literately have to throw the fire out and clean them from the inside. It's actually the same with oil fireing, but all you have to do to clean them is to let them suck some sand.

I noticed a slight design flaw on the Minsk class armored cruiser in that a foot of the hull is unarmored. I'm not sure how that happened, but the difference is small enough that it has no major effect on the design once implemented. Here is the Minskv3, which differs from the v2 in having that extra foot of armored area:

Minskv3, Russia Armored Cruiser laid down 1900

Displacement:
   13,300 t light; 13,918 t standard; 15,391 t normal; 16,569 t full load

Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep)
   (555.00 ft / 555.00 ft) x 70.50 ft x (25.00 / 26.51 ft)
   (169.16 m / 169.16 m) x 21.49 m  x (7.62 / 8.08 m)

Armament:
      6 - 10.00" / 254 mm 45.0 cal guns - 500.01lbs / 226.80kg shells, 100 per gun
     Breech loading guns in turret on barbette mounts, 1900 Model
     3 x Twin mounts on centreline ends, majority aft
      6 - 6.00" / 152 mm 45.0 cal guns - 89.99lbs / 40.82kg shells, 200 per gun
     Quick firing guns in deck and hoist mounts, 1900 Model
     3 x Twin mounts on centreline ends, majority aft
      3 raised mounts
      8 - 6.00" / 152 mm 45.0 cal guns - 89.99lbs / 40.82kg shells, 150 per gun
     Quick firing guns in casemate mounts, 1900 Model
     8 x Single mounts on sides, evenly spread
      12 - 3.00" / 76.2 mm 50.0 cal guns - 11.99lbs / 5.44kg shells, 300 per gun
     Quick firing guns in deck mounts, 1900 Model
     12 x Single mounts on sides, evenly spread
      12 raised mounts
      Weight of broadside 4,404 lbs / 1,998 kg

Armour:
   - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   6.00" / 152 mm   435.00 ft / 132.59 m   13.00 ft / 3.96 m
   Ends:   3.00" / 76 mm   120.00 ft / 36.58 m   8.00 ft / 2.44 m
   Upper:   3.00" / 76 mm   300.00 ft / 91.44 m   8.00 ft / 2.44 m
     Main Belt covers 121 % of normal length

   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   6.00" / 152 mm   3.00" / 76 mm      6.00" / 152 mm
   2nd:   6.00" / 152 mm   3.00" / 76 mm            -
   3rd:   3.00" / 76 mm         -         3.00" / 76 mm

   - Armoured deck - single deck:
   For and Aft decks: 1.50" / 38 mm
   Forecastle: 1.50" / 38 mm  Quarter deck: 1.50" / 38 mm

   - Conning towers: Forward 10.00" / 254 mm, Aft 0.00" / 0 mm

Machinery:
   Coal fired boilers, complex reciprocating steam engines,
   Direct drive, 2 shafts, 29,400 ihp / 21,932 Kw = 22.47 kts
   Range 8,000nm at 10.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 2,651 tons (100% coal)

Complement:
   690 - 898

Cost:
   £1.504 million / $6.016 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 996 tons, 6.5 %
      - Guns: 996 tons, 6.5 %
   Armour: 3,252 tons, 21.1 %
      - Belts: 1,801 tons, 11.7 %
      - Armament: 553 tons, 3.6 %
      - Armour Deck: 765 tons, 5.0 %
      - Conning Tower: 133 tons, 0.9 %
   Machinery: 4,594 tons, 29.8 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 4,421 tons, 28.7 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 2,091 tons, 13.6 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 37 tons, 0.2 %
      - Hull below water: 12 tons
      - Above deck: 25 tons

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     11,181 lbs / 5,072 Kg = 22.4 x 10.0 " / 254 mm shells or 1.4 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.32
   Metacentric height 4.9 ft / 1.5 m
   Roll period: 13.4 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 76 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.48
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1.54

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has a flush deck,
     a normal bow and a cruiser stern
   Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0.551 / 0.559
   Length to Beam Ratio: 7.87 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 23.56 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 44 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 49
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 0.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
   Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length):
            Fore end,    Aft end
      - Forecastle:   17.00 %,  23.00 ft / 7.01 m,  18.00 ft / 5.49 m
      - Forward deck:   40.00 %,  18.00 ft / 5.49 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Aft deck:   31.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Quarter deck:   12.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Average freeboard:      17.08 ft / 5.21 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 120.4 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 124.9 %
   Waterplane Area: 27,325 Square feet or 2,539 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 95 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 121 lbs/sq ft or 592 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.96
      - Longitudinal: 1.33
      - Overall: 1.00
   Cramped machinery, storage, compartmentation space
   Excellent accommodation and workspace room
   Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
   Excellent seaboat, comfortable, can fire her guns in the heaviest weather

Below-decks miscellaneous weight accounts for 4 submerged broadside 18" 5m wet heater torpedo tubes and 8 reload torpedoes.

Above-decks miscellaneous weight allows for a long-range wireless installation.

This is a broadside torpedo cruiser concept. This particular design is not compatible with IRN doctrine and would likely be bombarded to pieces if built anyways. I am going to design a torpedo battleship/armored cruiser more suitable for the battleline.

Torpedo Cruiser, Russia Armored Torpedo Cruiser laid down 1900

Displacement:
   8,550 t light; 8,819 t standard; 9,656 t normal; 10,327 t full load

Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep)
   (488.00 ft / 480.00 ft) x 52.00 ft x (24.00 / 25.33 ft)
   (148.74 m / 146.30 m) x 15.85 m  x (7.32 / 7.72 m)

Armament:
      10 - 4.72" / 120 mm 45.0 cal guns - 50.00lbs / 22.68kg shells, 270 per gun
     Quick firing guns in deck mounts, 1900 Model
     2 x Single mounts on centreline ends, evenly spread
     8 x Single mounts on sides, evenly spread
      Weight of broadside 500 lbs / 227 kg

Armour:
   - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Ends:   Unarmoured
   Upper:   5.00" / 127 mm   480.00 ft / 146.30 m   5.00 ft / 1.52 m

   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   4th:   1.00" / 25 mm         -               -

   - Armoured deck - single deck:
   For and Aft decks: 2.00" / 51 mm
   Forecastle: 2.00" / 51 mm  Quarter deck: 2.00" / 51 mm

   - Conning towers: Forward 10.00" / 254 mm, Aft 0.00" / 0 mm

Machinery:
   Coal fired boilers, complex reciprocating steam engines,
   Direct drive, 3 shafts, 31,140 ihp / 23,230 Kw = 24.34 kts
   Range 6,000nm at 10.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 1,508 tons (100% coal)

Complement:
   486 - 633

Cost:
   £1.006 million / $4.023 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 93 tons, 1.0 %
      - Guns: 93 tons, 1.0 %
   Armour: 1,281 tons, 13.3 %
      - Belts: 444 tons, 4.6 %
      - Armament: 81 tons, 0.8 %
      - Armour Deck: 658 tons, 6.8 %
      - Conning Tower: 98 tons, 1.0 %
   Machinery: 4,866 tons, 50.4 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 2,186 tons, 22.6 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 1,106 tons, 11.5 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 125 tons, 1.3 %
      - Hull below water: 100 tons
      - Above deck: 25 tons

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     3,596 lbs / 1,631 Kg = 7.2 x 6 " / 152 mm shells or 0.6 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.45
   Metacentric height 3.5 ft / 1.1 m
   Roll period: 11.6 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 75 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.08
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1.27

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has a flush deck,
     a ram bow and a cruiser stern
   Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0.564 / 0.572
   Length to Beam Ratio: 9.23 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 21.91 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 51 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 59
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): -10.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
   Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length):
            Fore end,    Aft end
      - Forecastle:   20.00 %,  14.00 ft / 4.27 m,  14.00 ft / 4.27 m
      - Forward deck:   30.00 %,  14.00 ft / 4.27 m,  14.00 ft / 4.27 m
      - Aft deck:   35.00 %,  14.00 ft / 4.27 m,  14.00 ft / 4.27 m
      - Quarter deck:   15.00 %,  14.00 ft / 4.27 m,  14.00 ft / 4.27 m
      - Average freeboard:      14.00 ft / 4.27 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 167.0 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 96.9 %
   Waterplane Area: 17,653 Square feet or 1,640 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 85 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 78 lbs/sq ft or 380 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.98
      - Longitudinal: 1.22
      - Overall: 1.00
   Cramped machinery, storage, compartmentation space
   Adequate accommodation and workspace room
   Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
   Good seaboat, rides out heavy weather easily

Miscellaneous weight:
100 tons hull below water is for 6 x 18 inch torpedo tubes (2 fore, 2 aft, 8 each broadside) with 8 x 1,250 pound torpedoes each.
25 tons above deck reserve weight.

Armor in protected cruiser configuration.

It's not really an armored cruiser, but given that its primary armament is torpedoes I thought calling it a battleship would be a bit unusual.

Torpedo Armored Cruiser, Russia Torpedo Armored Cruiser laid down 1900

Displacement:
   8,000 t light; 8,450 t standard; 9,496 t normal; 10,333 t full load

Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep)
   (392.00 ft / 384.00 ft) x 58.00 ft (Bulges 64.00 ft) x (24.00 / 25.86 ft)
   (119.48 m / 117.04 m) x 17.68 m (Bulges 19.51 m)  x (7.32 / 7.88 m)

Armament:
      4 - 12.00" / 305 mm 40.0 cal guns - 749.99lbs / 340.19kg shells, 80 per gun
     Breech loading guns in turret on barbette mounts, 1900 Model
     2 x Twin mounts on centreline ends, evenly spread
      12 - 6.00" / 152 mm 45.0 cal guns - 89.99lbs / 40.82kg shells, 180 per gun
     Quick firing guns in casemate mounts, 1900 Model
     12 x Single mounts on sides, evenly spread
      8 - 3.00" / 76.2 mm 50.0 cal guns - 11.99lbs / 5.44kg shells, 360 per gun
     Quick firing guns in deck mounts, 1900 Model
     8 x Single mounts on centreline ends, evenly spread
      8 raised mounts
      Weight of broadside 4,176 lbs / 1,894 kg

Armour:
   - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   12.0" / 305 mm   250.00 ft / 76.20 m   9.24 ft / 2.82 m
   Ends:   5.00" / 127 mm   134.00 ft / 40.84 m   9.24 ft / 2.82 m
   Upper:   5.00" / 127 mm   250.00 ft / 76.20 m   8.00 ft / 2.44 m
     Main Belt covers 100 % of normal length
     Main Belt inclined -30.00 degrees (positive = in)

   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   12.0" / 305 mm   5.00" / 127 mm      10.0" / 254 mm
   2nd:   3.00" / 76 mm         -               -
   3rd:   1.00" / 25 mm         -               -

   - Armoured deck - single deck:
   For and Aft decks: 2.00" / 51 mm
   Forecastle: 2.00" / 51 mm  Quarter deck: 2.00" / 51 mm

   - Conning towers: Forward 10.00" / 254 mm, Aft 10.00" / 254 mm

Machinery:
   Coal fired boilers, complex reciprocating steam engines,
   Direct drive, 2 shafts, 9,102 ihp / 6,790 Kw = 17.25 kts
   Range 8,000nm at 10.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 1,882 tons (100% coal)

Complement:
   480 - 625

Cost:
   £0.822 million / $3.288 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 770 tons, 8.1 %
      - Guns: 770 tons, 8.1 %
   Armour: 3,192 tons, 33.6 %
      - Belts: 1,863 tons, 19.6 %
      - Armament: 549 tons, 5.8 %
      - Armour Deck: 587 tons, 6.2 %
      - Conning Towers: 193 tons, 2.0 %
   Machinery: 1,422 tons, 15.0 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 2,491 tons, 26.2 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 1,496 tons, 15.8 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 125 tons, 1.3 %
      - Hull below water: 100 tons
      - Above deck: 25 tons

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     10,039 lbs / 4,554 Kg = 11.6 x 12.0 " / 305 mm shells or 1.8 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.26
   Metacentric height 3.4 ft / 1.0 m
   Roll period: 14.7 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 73 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.47
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1.40

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has a flush deck,
     a ram bow and a cruiser stern
   Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0.564 / 0.569
   Length to Beam Ratio: 6.00 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 19.60 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 44 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 52
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): -10.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
   Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length):
            Fore end,    Aft end
      - Forecastle:   20.00 %,  12.00 ft / 3.66 m,  12.00 ft / 3.66 m
      - Forward deck:   30.00 %,  12.00 ft / 3.66 m,  12.00 ft / 3.66 m
      - Aft deck:   35.00 %,  12.00 ft / 3.66 m,  12.00 ft / 3.66 m
      - Quarter deck:   15.00 %,  12.00 ft / 3.66 m,  12.00 ft / 3.66 m
      - Average freeboard:      12.00 ft / 3.66 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 83.2 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 75.0 %
   Waterplane Area: 15,742 Square feet or 1,462 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 101 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 117 lbs/sq ft or 573 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.94
      - Longitudinal: 1.87
      - Overall: 1.01
   Excellent machinery, storage, compartmentation space
   Cramped accommodation and workspace room
   Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
   Good seaboat, rides out heavy weather easily

Tumblehome hull.

Belt and end armor belts cover 8 feet vertically. Belt armor is equivalent to 16.17 inches of vertical armor, end armor is equivalent to 6.93 inches of vertical armor.

Miscellaneous weight:
100 tons hull below water is for 6 x 18 inch torpedo tubes (2 fore, 2 aft, 8 each broadside) with 8 x 1,250 pound torpedoes each.
25 tons above deck reserve weight.

so you claim it has 2 tubes foreward, 2 aft and 8 on each broadside? I dont see any torpedos on it (Seriously people the tools are there USE THEM), also with its extreamly slow speed I question its ability to get into range to use the torpedos if it dod have them, I also question if 20 torpedo tubes would even fit on the hull (seriously the engines and boilers have to fit somewhere)

other than that looks good (even if I do think Tumblehomes should never have been allowed)

Quote from: Tanthalas on March 08, 2013, 02:05:42 AM
so you claim it has 2 tubes foreward, 2 aft and 8 on each broadside? I dont see any torpedos on it (Seriously people the tools are there USE THEM), also with its extreamly slow speed I question its ability to get into range to use the torpedos if it dod have them, I also question if 20 torpedo tubes would even fit on the hull (seriously the engines and boilers have to fit somewhere)

other than that looks good (even if I do think Tumblehomes should never have been allowed)

I thought we can sim torpedoes as miscellaneous weight? As for speed, it is intended to be part of the battleline so it has the same speed as the battleships. Lastly, think of how much faster this ship will sink once damaged below the waterline, it's tumblehome with several pre-cut holes.

Quote from: Delta Force on March 08, 2013, 02:32:20 AM

I thought we can sim torpedoes as miscellaneous weight?

I thought this too

Quote from: Darman on March 08, 2013, 05:40:42 AM

Quote from: Delta Force on March 08, 2013, 02:32:20 AM

I thought we can sim torpedoes as miscellaneous weight?

I thought this too

That's certainly the decision that was taken in the 4.5 days (as a result of this poll: http://www.navalism.org/index.php/topic,5836.0.html), and what I've been doing ever since.

Ah, the torpedo battleship.  The USN historically wargamed with a ship somewhat like this during the mid-1900s, but found that it needed to be faster than the battleline to get into position, and that (of course) it was a shell magnet.

Quote from: KWorld on March 08, 2013, 06:15:52 AM
Ah, the torpedo battleship.  The USN historically wargamed with a ship somewhat like this during the mid-1900s, but found that it needed to be faster than the battleline to get into position, and that (of course) it was a shell magnet.

Hrm... what if you could bring the enemy battleline to your torpedo battleship?  And made it much harder to see and hit from a distance?

Quote from: Darman on March 08, 2013, 07:41:27 AM

Quote from: KWorld on March 08, 2013, 06:15:52 AM
Ah, the torpedo battleship.  The USN historically wargamed with a ship somewhat like this during the mid-1900s, but found that it needed to be faster than the battleline to get into position, and that (of course) it was a shell magnet.

Hrm... what if you could bring the enemy battleline to your torpedo battleship?  And made it much harder to see and hit from a distance?

Sounds like a submarine to me..... :)


Basically, from what I read about the USN's testing of the idea, the problem was that the "torpedo battleship" had to get in a position well to the front of the enemy battle line, so it's torpedoes would have time to reach the battle line while they still had the range to do so.  If the friendly battle line reached that position relative to the enemy line, the enemy would simply turn away to open up their gun arcs.

they can but you should atleast put the torpedo tubes on the ship... Spring sharp gives you the weight of the tube and one torpedo (if you save and reload the ship) so reloads (if any) need to be simd as misc weight.  Atleast that is the way I have always done it.  Ill post some examples in General Naval Discussion, and I will admit in advance I havnt been paying atention to torpedo carying ships (or atleast not as much as I should have aparently).

Quote from: KWorld on March 08, 2013, 08:05:18 AM
Sounds like a submarine to me..... :)

You'd think, right? ;)

Quote from: Darman on March 08, 2013, 10:34:17 AM

Quote from: KWorld on March 08, 2013, 08:05:18 AM
Sounds like a submarine to me..... :)

You'd think, right? ;)

Only other option I can think of, in the days of coal smoke and steam and before the torpedo bomber, is a low-profile torpedo vessel that's running slowly, but either one (sub or surface) is tough to arrange: you have to engage the enemy battle line and bring them to where you want them, so they run over the slow torpedo carriers.

Quote from: KWorld on March 08, 2013, 10:54:55 AM
Only other option I can think of, in the days of coal smoke and steam and before the torpedo bomber, is a low-profile torpedo vessel that's running slowly, but either one (sub or surface) is tough to arrange: you have to engage the enemy battle line and bring them to where you want them, so they run over the slow torpedo carriers.

Agreed.  Unless you control a strategic point which the enemy needs to approach.  Which is, of course, the essence of a tactically defensive but strategically offensive strategy, take something your enemy needs to take back and bleed him dry when he attempts it. 

Quote from: Darman on March 08, 2013, 11:00:57 AM

Quote from: KWorld on March 08, 2013, 10:54:55 AM
Only other option I can think of, in the days of coal smoke and steam and before the torpedo bomber, is a low-profile torpedo vessel that's running slowly, but either one (sub or surface) is tough to arrange: you have to engage the enemy battle line and bring them to where you want them, so they run over the slow torpedo carriers.

Agreed.  Unless you control a strategic point which the enemy needs to approach.  Which is, of course, the essence of a tactically defensive but strategically offensive strategy, take something your enemy needs to take back and bleed him dry when he attempts it.

Even then, using subs or slow surface torpedo vessels will be problematic, outside of very constrained spaces like the Dardanelles or some Norwegian fiords.  A small turn by your opponent, made to (for instance) clear the smoke from the director, will take the battle line outside torpedo range of your vessel, and there's nothing the slow vessel can do about it. 

This is very true.  Its best if they are surprise weapons reserved for occassions where you are sure of hitting at least one target. 

I just realized that a torpedo battleship could be used not so much to actually hit other ships (although it is certainly possible with dozens of torpedoes being fired by a single ship) as to cause the enemy line to scatter, making it easier for torpedo boats to pounce on a larger ship. It might also cause the enemy line to turn into a minefield or (once more developed) submarine ambush.

Also, how hard would it be to disguise a torpedo broadside ship as another ship to avoid it becoming a shell magnet? Could it be made to look similar to a regular armored cruiser (similar dimensions and attacking with them so it's not blatantly obvious), perhaps with dummy turrets and guns that emit pyrotechnic smoke?

Quote from: Delta Force on March 08, 2013, 12:44:42 PM
I just realized that a torpedo battleship could be used not so much to actually hit other ships (although it is certainly possible with dozens of torpedoes being fired by a single ship) as to cause the enemy line to scatter, making it easier for torpedo boats to pounce on a larger ship. It might also cause the enemy line to turn into a minefield or (once more developed) submarine ambush.

Of course, but the ocean's a big place, and at this time period your position's something that's dead-reckoned, unless you're close enough to shore to get a triangulated position.  So getting this sort of ambush positioning right is .... difficult.

QuoteAlso, how hard would it be to disguise a torpedo broadside ship as another ship to avoid it becoming a shell magnet? Could it be made to look similar to a regular armored cruiser (similar dimensions and attacking with them so it's not blatantly obvious), perhaps with dummy turrets and guns that emit pyrotechnic smoke?

Technically, that sort of visual camouflage would be possible.  It won't take long, though, for the enemy to figure out that there are more shots being fired at us than there are splashes around us.

I'm sure that a demonstration of the use of torpedoes in confined sea-lanes could be arranged.... the Ottomans would like to formally invite the russians to attempt to force the straits ;)