Quote
Enter ship name, Enter country Enter ship type laid down 1921
Displacement:
12.607 t light; 13.093 t standard; 14.015 t normal; 14.752 t full load
Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
603,99 ft / 600,39 ft x 75,46 ft x 24,61 ft (normal load)
184,10 m / 183,00 m x 23,00 m x 7,50 m
Armament:
8 - 7,87" / 200 mm guns (4x2 guns), 244,10lbs / 110,72kg shells, 1921 Model
Breech loading guns in deck mounts with hoists
on centreline ends, evenly spread, 2 raised mounts - superfiring
12 - 3,94" / 100 mm guns (6x2 guns), 30,51lbs / 13,84kg shells, 1921 Model
Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts
on side, all amidships, all raised mounts - superfiring
16 - 1,57" / 40,0 mm guns in single mounts, 1,95lbs / 0,89kg shells, 1921 Model
Breech loading guns in deck mounts
on side, evenly spread, all raised mounts
Weight of broadside 2.350 lbs / 1.066 kg
Shells per gun, main battery: 150
Armour:
- Belts: Width (max) Length (avg) Height (avg)
Main: 5,91" / 150 mm 390,26 ft / 118,95 m 19,82 ft / 6,04 m
Ends: Unarmoured
Main Belt covers 100 % of normal length
- Gun armour: Face (max) Other gunhouse (avg) Barbette/hoist (max)
Main: 5,91" / 150 mm 2,76" / 70 mm 5,91" / 150 mm
2nd: 0,79" / 20 mm - -
- Armour deck: 2,76" / 70 mm, Conning tower: 5,91" / 150 mm
Machinery:
Oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
Electric cruising motors plus geared drives, 4 shafts, 91.052 shp / 67.925 Kw = 31,00 kts
Range 4.500nm at 16,00 kts
Bunker at max displacement = 1.659 tons
Complement:
643 - 837
Cost:
£2,869 million / $11,475 million
Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
Armament: 294 tons, 2,1 %
Armour: 3.665 tons, 26,1 %
- Belts: 1.932 tons, 13,8 %
- Torpedo bulkhead: 0 tons, 0,0 %
- Armament: 197 tons, 1,4 %
- Armour Deck: 1.462 tons, 10,4 %
- Conning Tower: 74 tons, 0,5 %
Machinery: 3.135 tons, 22,4 %
Hull, fittings & equipment: 4.914 tons, 35,1 %
Fuel, ammunition & stores: 1.407 tons, 10,0 %
Miscellaneous weights: 600 tons, 4,3 %
Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
15.835 lbs / 7.182 Kg = 64,9 x 7,9 " / 200 mm shells or 2,1 torpedoes
Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1,13
Metacentric height 4,1 ft / 1,3 m
Roll period: 15,6 seconds
Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 71 %
- Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0,28
Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1,04
Hull form characteristics:
Hull has a flush deck
Block coefficient: 0,440
Length to Beam Ratio: 7,96 : 1
'Natural speed' for length: 24,50 kts
Power going to wave formation at top speed: 55 %
Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 68
Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 10,00 degrees
Stern overhang: 0,00 ft / 0,00 m
Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
- Stem: 20,41 ft / 6,22 m
- Forecastle (20 %): 17,16 ft / 5,23 m
- Mid (50 %): 17,16 ft / 5,23 m
- Quarterdeck (15 %): 17,16 ft / 5,23 m
- Stern: 17,16 ft / 5,23 m
- Average freeboard: 17,42 ft / 5,31 m
Ship tends to be wet forward
Ship space, strength and comments:
Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 93,9 %
- Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 145,7 %
Waterplane Area: 28.668 Square feet or 2.663 Square metres
Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 109 %
Structure weight / hull surface area: 116 lbs/sq ft or 568 Kg/sq metre
Hull strength (Relative):
- Cross-sectional: 0,96
- Longitudinal: 1,35
- Overall: 1,00
Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is adequate
Room for accommodation and workspaces is excellent
Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
Very solid looking - esp. strong on protection
But i think a bit more firepower would give better return for combat - trade-off of extra Twin turret vs. bit less protection - would be interesting to check ....
The heavy AA looks at least 5 years too early ........
I agree with Menta,
8x200 on 12600t is short & too much AA guns for 1921.
Very good protection (26%).
Armor deck-70mm,; perhaps too much...
A good Cruiser but for NUS, not well balanced.
...But that's your cruiser...
Jef ;)
Reduced A/A gun and shortened a bit to fit into a Type 2 slip/dock:
QuoteZara, Esc Fleet-cruiser laid down 1921
Displacement:
10.997 t light; 11.421 t standard; 12.268 t normal; 12.946 t full load
Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
590,54 ft / 586,94 ft x 75,46 ft x 24,61 ft (normal load)
180,00 m / 178,90 m x 23,00 m x 7,50 m
Armament:
8 - 7,87" / 200 mm guns (4x2 guns), 244,10lbs / 110,72kg shells, 1921 Model
Breech loading guns in deck mounts with hoists
on centreline ends, evenly spread, 2 raised mounts - superfiring
4 - 3,94" / 100 mm guns in single mounts, 30,51lbs / 13,84kg shells, 1921 Model
Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts
on side, all amidships, all raised mounts - superfiring
10 - 1,57" / 40,0 mm guns in single mounts, 1,95lbs / 0,88kg shells, 1921 Model
Breech loading guns in deck mounts
on side, evenly spread, all raised mounts
Weight of broadside 2.094 lbs / 950 kg
Shells per gun, main battery: 150
Armour:
- Belts: Width (max) Length (avg) Height (avg)
Main: 5,91" / 150 mm 374,02 ft / 114,00 m 10,43 ft / 3,18 m
Ends: Unarmoured
Main Belt covers 98 % of normal length
- Gun armour: Face (max) Other gunhouse (avg) Barbette/hoist (max)
Main: 5,91" / 150 mm 2,76" / 70 mm 5,91" / 150 mm
2nd: 0,79" / 20 mm - -
- Armour deck: 2,76" / 70 mm, Conning tower: 5,91" / 150 mm
Machinery:
Oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
Electric cruising motors plus geared drives, 4 shafts, 82.885 shp / 61.832 Kw = 31,00 kts
Range 4.500nm at 16,00 kts
Bunker at max displacement = 1.526 tons
Complement:
582 - 757
Cost:
£2,557 million / $10,227 million
Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
Armament: 262 tons, 2,1 %
Armour: 2.623 tons, 21,4 %
- Belts: 976 tons, 8,0 %
- Torpedo bulkhead: 0 tons, 0,0 %
- Armament: 193 tons, 1,6 %
- Armour Deck: 1.385 tons, 11,3 %
- Conning Tower: 68 tons, 0,6 %
Machinery: 2.854 tons, 23,3 %
Hull, fittings & equipment: 4.659 tons, 38,0 %
Fuel, ammunition & stores: 1.271 tons, 10,4 %
Miscellaneous weights: 600 tons, 4,9 %
Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
13.804 lbs / 6.262 Kg = 56,6 x 7,9 " / 200 mm shells or 1,9 torpedoes
Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1,11
Metacentric height 4,0 ft / 1,2 m
Roll period: 15,8 seconds
Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 75 %
- Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0,28
Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1,11
Hull form characteristics:
Hull has a flush deck
Block coefficient: 0,394
Length to Beam Ratio: 7,78 : 1
'Natural speed' for length: 24,23 kts
Power going to wave formation at top speed: 54 %
Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 68
Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 10,00 degrees
Stern overhang: 0,00 ft / 0,00 m
Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
- Stem: 20,41 ft / 6,22 m
- Forecastle (20 %): 17,16 ft / 5,23 m
- Mid (50 %): 17,16 ft / 5,23 m
- Quarterdeck (15 %): 17,16 ft / 5,23 m
- Stern: 17,16 ft / 5,23 m
- Average freeboard: 17,42 ft / 5,31 m
Ship tends to be wet forward
Ship space, strength and comments:
Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 97,7 %
- Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 152,6 %
Waterplane Area: 27.175 Square feet or 2.525 Square metres
Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 111 %
Structure weight / hull surface area: 116 lbs/sq ft or 568 Kg/sq metre
Hull strength (Relative):
- Cross-sectional: 0,95
- Longitudinal: 1,52
- Overall: 1,00
Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is adequate
Room for accommodation and workspaces is excellent
Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
And another with increased main battery:
Quote
Zara, Esc Fleet-cruiser laid down 1921
Displacement:
11.424 t light; 11.898 t standard; 12.766 t normal; 13.461 t full load
Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
590,54 ft / 586,94 ft x 75,46 ft x 24,61 ft (normal load)
180,00 m / 178,90 m x 23,00 m x 7,50 m
Armament:
10 - 7,87" / 200 mm guns (4 mounts), 244,10lbs / 110,72kg shells, 1921 Model
Breech loading guns in deck mounts with hoists 2x3gun 2x2 superfiring
on centreline ends, evenly spread, 2 raised mounts - superfiring
4 - 3,94" / 100 mm guns in single mounts, 30,51lbs / 13,84kg shells, 1921 Model
Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts
on side, all amidships, all raised mounts - superfiring
10 - 1,57" / 40,0 mm guns in single mounts, 1,95lbs / 0,88kg shells, 1921 Model
Breech loading guns in deck mounts
on side, evenly spread, all raised mounts
Weight of broadside 2.583 lbs / 1.171 kg
Shells per gun, main battery: 150
Armour:
- Belts: Width (max) Length (avg) Height (avg)
Main: 5,91" / 150 mm 381,23 ft / 116,20 m 10,43 ft / 3,18 m
Ends: Unarmoured
Main Belt covers 100 % of normal length
- Gun armour: Face (max) Other gunhouse (avg) Barbette/hoist (max)
Main: 5,91" / 150 mm 2,76" / 70 mm 5,91" / 150 mm
2nd: 0,79" / 20 mm - -
- Armour deck: 2,76" / 70 mm, Conning tower: 5,91" / 150 mm
Machinery:
Oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
Electric cruising motors plus geared drives, 4 shafts, 85.663 shp / 63.905 Kw = 31,00 kts
Range 4.500nm at 16,00 kts
Bunker at max displacement = 1.563 tons
Complement:
599 - 780
Cost:
£2,759 million / $11,037 million
Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
Armament: 323 tons, 2,5 %
Armour: 2.701 tons, 21,2 %
- Belts: 993 tons, 7,8 %
- Torpedo bulkhead: 0 tons, 0,0 %
- Armament: 240 tons, 1,9 %
- Armour Deck: 1.398 tons, 11,0 %
- Conning Tower: 69 tons, 0,5 %
Machinery: 2.950 tons, 23,1 %
Hull, fittings & equipment: 4.850 tons, 38,0 %
Fuel, ammunition & stores: 1.343 tons, 10,5 %
Miscellaneous weights: 600 tons, 4,7 %
Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
13.768 lbs / 6.245 Kg = 56,4 x 7,9 " / 200 mm shells or 1,9 torpedoes
Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1,11
Metacentric height 4,0 ft / 1,2 m
Roll period: 15,9 seconds
Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 72 %
- Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0,33
Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1,06
Hull form characteristics:
Hull has a flush deck
Block coefficient: 0,410
Length to Beam Ratio: 7,78 : 1
'Natural speed' for length: 24,23 kts
Power going to wave formation at top speed: 55 %
Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 68
Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 10,00 degrees
Stern overhang: 0,00 ft / 0,00 m
Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
- Stem: 20,41 ft / 6,22 m
- Forecastle (20 %): 17,16 ft / 5,23 m
- Mid (50 %): 17,16 ft / 5,23 m
- Quarterdeck (15 %): 17,16 ft / 5,23 m
- Stern: 17,16 ft / 5,23 m
- Average freeboard: 17,42 ft / 5,31 m
Ship tends to be wet forward
Ship space, strength and comments:
Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 99,9 %
- Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 149,7 %
Waterplane Area: 27.428 Square feet or 2.548 Square metres
Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 108 %
Structure weight / hull surface area: 120 lbs/sq ft or 586 Kg/sq metre
Hull strength (Relative):
- Cross-sectional: 0,95
- Longitudinal: 1,50
- Overall: 1,00
Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is adequate
Room for accommodation and workspaces is excellent
Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
You have like 2 or 3 times the AAA projection you should for a ship that sized in this time period. Thats an early WW2 outfit.
Do we need a AAA tech tree and hard limits on numbers of AAA? Seriously this is 1920, I don't think any BB's had 10 AAA and the weapons were heavier.
Michael
I intend to go w/ something along the lines of the following:
BB/BC: 4x88mm, 2-4x37mm, 4-6x15mm
AC/CA: 2x88mm, 4-6x15mm
CL: 2x37mm, 2-4x15mm
DD: 1x37mm, 2-4x15mm
They're 180 meters long, which means you will still need a Type 3 slip/dock for them because a type 2 is only 170 m long.
Well, here's a question - warships have been sunk and damaged by aerial torpedoes in actual combat. Would that not bolster the minimum acceptable AA outfit?
Also, HMS Nelson - first post war Brit BB laid down, was fitted with 6 dual 6/50 (meant to be dual purpose), 6 4.7/40, 8 2 pound AA. The Italian Caracciolo was to have 8 single 4/45, 12 40 mm.
So, the ESC cruiser does have less than a period BB.
The Kent class initially had : 4x4", 4x40mm. The ESC ship has more.
The Kent class by 1937 had: 6x 4" AA, 12 x 20mm, and 2x'Pom Pom' (16x40mm). The Esc ship has less.
On the AA - 4 x 100 mm seems fine - the 10 x 40 mm a bit high - but more can always be added later
I wouldn't have thought that Fast Heavy Cruiser will fit in 170m - but notice BC on the 2 recent designs is quite low - will they fit ??
Oh - and I like the BIG one - 10 x 200mm - YO !! ;D
Real History is the reference... OK
But in our Nverse, a fleet, in the Rift War, in 1919, received a serious aircrafts attack & some ships were seriously damaged.
IMO, our Nverse could instal a little more AA guns that the real Nelson or Counties class.
Jef
The war was still short and the number of combatants limited. I'd like to see some story lines about various efforts to develop useful AA systems before our ships start sprouting large AA batteries.
I have a story I am contimplating about a report from the Italians. It covers a few things such as crowding among the target ships prohibiting them from freely manuvering to avoid the attack.
There are some facts and such that need to be added including how quickly the Italia Stockpile of Torpedoes was depleted by aircraft usage and the failures of subsequent attacks.
But yes some cruisers were hit by torpedoes launched from the air, the fact that the targets of those torpedoes were supposed to be freighters full of troops, equipment and munitions does not change the fact that ships at sea were hit from the air.
I agree we need to start looking at a Tech for Dual Purpose [1922 Changes]
Also I am not sure directly how many people know about the Airstrikes other then the person who delivered it and the recepients. I know I shared info with some people and some obserers will know.
One thing is proved with the Rift War;
Ships can be attacked by aircrafts comming from land.
NUS recommends 4 to 8 medium AA guns (20 to 40mm) by ship.
Jef
Only NS really knows the true effects of the airstrike and it won't be revealing too much. Only one ship (a destroyer) was sunk and the rest only lightly damaged. According to official releases, the Italian attack was a complete failure.
I believe that some of my DDs and TBs have had run ins with planes that have resulted in sunken ships. Of couse in my case, these were small fast ships getting hit, but they are not designed to survive torp hits anyway. Cause for putting a bit heavier AA on, I think so. Now jumping up to 5" DP, not quite
Only 2 Ships hit by Air Dropped Torpedos have survived, Constellation and Launceston. Now my TWIN Engined Medium Bombers were using 16" Torps and given that Torps fired from Subs and Destroyers in this age have a horrible malfunction rate the 100 or so bombers in the First Torpedo attack seemed to have done miraculously well with 50 or so attacking and 43 drops and 6 hits so yea really lucky attack. Either that or the New Swiss were so packed together with a fleet of like 80 ships that Torpedoes had multipule chances to hit running through the colums of ships. That sounds like what happened on that 6th hit the Destroyer was busy not getting ramed by a cruiser and ate a torp.
Anyway once Foxy gets the Constellation and Launceston to a Swiss Dry Dock he can actually do a real clinical examination of the damage. Of course if they spent any time in a New Zion Dry Dock or somewhere else information might spread. :o
Finalized version,I guess. ;)
Quote
Enter ship name, Enter country Enter ship type laid down 1921
Displacement:
11.978 t light; 12.422 t standard; 13.314 t normal; 14.028 t full load
Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
603,99 ft / 600,39 ft x 75,46 ft x 24,61 ft (normal load)
184,10 m / 183,00 m x 23,00 m x 7,50 m
Armament:
8 - 7,87" / 200 mm guns (4x2 guns), 244,10lbs / 110,72kg shells, 1921 Model
Breech loading guns in deck mounts with hoists
on centreline ends, evenly spread, 2 raised mounts - superfiring
4 - 3,94" / 100 mm guns in single mounts, 30,51lbs / 13,84kg shells, 1921 Model
Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts
on side, evenly spread, all raised mounts
6 - 1,57" / 40,0 mm guns in single mounts, 1,95lbs / 0,88kg shells, 1921 Model
Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts
on side, evenly spread, all raised mounts
Weight of broadside 2.087 lbs / 946 kg
Shells per gun, main battery: 150
Armour:
- Belts: Width (max) Length (avg) Height (avg)
Main: 4,72" / 120 mm 383,69 ft / 116,95 m 19,82 ft / 6,04 m
Ends: Unarmoured
Main Belt covers 98 % of normal length
- Gun armour: Face (max) Other gunhouse (avg) Barbette/hoist (max)
Main: 5,91" / 150 mm 1,97" / 50 mm 3,94" / 100 mm
2nd: 0,79" / 20 mm - -
- Armour deck: 2,76" / 70 mm, Conning tower: 5,91" / 150 mm
Machinery:
Oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
Electric cruising motors plus geared drives, 4 shafts, 93.021 shp / 69.393 Kw = 31,50 kts
Range 4.500nm at 16,00 kts
Bunker at max displacement = 1.606 tons
Complement:
619 - 805
Cost:
£2,766 million / $11,065 million
Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
Armament: 261 tons, 2,0 %
Armour: 3.193 tons, 24,0 %
- Belts: 1.521 tons, 11,4 %
- Torpedo bulkhead: 0 tons, 0,0 %
- Armament: 162 tons, 1,2 %
- Armour Deck: 1.438 tons, 10,8 %
- Conning Tower: 71 tons, 0,5 %
Machinery: 3.203 tons, 24,1 %
Hull, fittings & equipment: 4.772 tons, 35,8 %
Fuel, ammunition & stores: 1.336 tons, 10,0 %
Miscellaneous weights: 550 tons, 4,1 %
Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
14.400 lbs / 6.532 Kg = 59,0 x 7,9 " / 200 mm shells or 1,9 torpedoes
Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1,13
Metacentric height 4,1 ft / 1,3 m
Roll period: 15,6 seconds
Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 71 %
- Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0,24
Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1,01
Hull form characteristics:
Hull has a flush deck
Block coefficient: 0,418
Length to Beam Ratio: 7,96 : 1
'Natural speed' for length: 24,50 kts
Power going to wave formation at top speed: 55 %
Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 70
Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 10,00 degrees
Stern overhang: 0,00 ft / 0,00 m
Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
- Stem: 20,41 ft / 6,22 m
- Forecastle (20 %): 16,40 ft / 5,00 m
- Mid (50 %): 16,40 ft / 5,00 m
- Quarterdeck (15 %): 16,40 ft / 5,00 m
- Stern: 16,40 ft / 5,00 m
- Average freeboard: 16,72 ft / 5,10 m
Ship tends to be wet forward
Ship space, strength and comments:
Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 98,1 %
- Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 142,4 %
Waterplane Area: 28.206 Square feet or 2.620 Square metres
Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 109 %
Structure weight / hull surface area: 116 lbs/sq ft or 565 Kg/sq metre
Hull strength (Relative):
- Cross-sectional: 0,97
- Longitudinal: 1,34
- Overall: 1,00
Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is adequate
Room for accommodation and workspaces is excellent
Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform