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Main Archive => General Gameplay Topics => Meeting Room (N3) => Topic started by: Carthaginian on January 27, 2009, 11:08:11 PM

Title: SHIPS FOR SALE OR LEASE
Post by: Carthaginian on January 27, 2009, 11:08:11 PM
These high-mileage, one owner, recently refurbished pre-dreadnoughts are being offered as-is with no warrenty or guarantees of any kind, explicit or implied. All sales final; no refunds or returns. No rain checks... when they are gone, they are GONE!

Will sell armed to any nation for use on the guaranteed condition of minimum 5 years service in their fleet before scrapping.
Will sell minus weapons to any party interested if the contracting party's offer is accepted by the House of Lords.
All state secrets will be removed prior to sale unless such is also approved for sale under separate terms.

Initial bidding will start at 150% scrap value armed, 100% scrap value unarmed.


QuoteHMS Ocean and HMS Vengeance

Displacement:
   10,252 t light; 10,770 t standard; 11,831 t normal; 12,680 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
   400.00 ft / 400.00 ft x 72.00 ft x 26.00 ft (normal load)
   121.92 m / 121.92 m x 21.95 m  x 7.92 m

Armament:
      4 - 12.00" / 305 mm guns (2x2 guns), 870.00lbs / 394.63kg shells, 1906 Model
     Breech loading guns in turrets (on barbettes)
     on centreline ends, evenly spread
      12 - 6.00" / 152 mm guns in single mounts, 100.00lbs / 45.36kg shells, 1906 Model
     Breech loading guns in casemate mounts
     on side, evenly spread
     12 guns in hull casemates - Limited use in all but light seas
      4 - 3.00" / 76.2 mm guns in single mounts, 13.00lbs / 5.90kg shells, 1906 Model
     Quick firing guns in casemate mounts
     on side, all aft
     4 guns in hull casemates - Limited use in all but light seas
      6 - 3.00" / 76.2 mm guns in single mounts, 13.00lbs / 5.90kg shells, 1906 Model
     Quick firing guns in deck mounts
     on centreline, evenly spread, all raised mounts
      4 - 1.85" / 47.0 mm guns in single mounts, 3.30lbs / 1.50kg shells, 1906 Model
     Quick firing guns in deck mounts
     on centreline, evenly spread, all raised mounts
   Weight of broadside 4,823 lbs / 2,188 kg
   Shells per gun, main battery: 100

Armour:
   - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   11.0" / 279 mm   260.00 ft / 79.25 m   12.00 ft / 3.66 m
   Ends:   5.00" / 127 mm   140.00 ft / 42.67 m   12.00 ft / 3.66 m
   Upper:   4.00" / 102 mm   260.00 ft / 79.25 m   8.00 ft / 2.44 m
     Main Belt covers 100 % of normal length

   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   12.0" / 305 mm   8.00" / 203 mm      10.0" / 254 mm
   2nd:   3.00" / 76 mm         -         1.00" / 25 mm
   3rd:   3.00" / 76 mm         -         1.00" / 25 mm

   - Armour deck: 2.50" / 64 mm, Conning tower: 12.00" / 305 mm

Machinery:
   Coal fired boilers, complex reciprocating steam engines,
   Direct drive, 2 shafts, 7,618 ihp / 5,683 Kw = 15.90 kts
   Range 6,120nm at 10.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 1,910 tons (100% coal)

Complement:
   566 - 737

Cost:
   £1.064 million / $4.255 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 612 tons, 5.2 %
   Armour: 4,095 tons, 34.6 %
      - Belts: 2,199 tons, 18.6 %
      - Torpedo bulkhead: 0 tons, 0.0 %
      - Armament: 830 tons, 7.0 %
      - Armour Deck: 932 tons, 7.9 %
      - Conning Tower: 134 tons, 1.1 %
   Machinery: 1,360 tons, 11.5 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 3,859 tons, 32.6 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 1,579 tons, 13.3 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 325 tons, 2.7 %

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     13,003 lbs / 5,898 Kg = 15.1 x 12.0 " / 305 mm shells or 2.1 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.16
   Metacentric height 4.0 ft / 1.2 m
   Roll period: 15.1 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 73 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.41
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1.47

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has a flush deck
   Block coefficient: 0.553
   Length to Beam Ratio: 5.56 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 20.00 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 40 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 50
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): -10.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
   Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
      - Stem:      17.50 ft / 5.33 m
      - Forecastle (20 %):   13.00 ft / 3.96 m
      - Mid (50 %):      13.00 ft / 3.96 m
      - Quarterdeck (15 %):   13.00 ft / 3.96 m
      - Stern:      13.00 ft / 3.96 m
      - Average freeboard:   13.36 ft / 4.07 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 79.5 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 88.2 %
   Waterplane Area: 20,156 Square feet or 1,873 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 98 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 134 lbs/sq ft or 655 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.92
      - Longitudinal: 2.03
      - Overall: 1.00
   Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is excellent
   Room for accommodation and workspaces is cramped
   Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
   Good seaboat, rides out heavy weather easily
Title: Re: SHIPS FOR SALE OR LEASE
Post by: Blooded on January 27, 2009, 11:48:42 PM
Hello,

Russia would put in a bid for 100% scrap value- unarmed. Say $2.70 each.


Armament and Turret armor= 1,442 tons
Ship then at 8,810 Tons x 15% = 1.3215   x2 = $2.643 each

Hope that meets your criteria.
Title: Re: SHIPS FOR SALE OR LEASE
Post by: Carthaginian on January 27, 2009, 11:55:58 PM
telegraph sent to Russian embasy

To HIH the Czar of Russia - OFFER FOR 2 OBB RECEIVED STOP OFFER FORWARDED TO COMMITTEE FOR CONSIDERATION STOP GOD SAVE THE CZAR END
Title: Re: SHIPS FOR SALE OR LEASE
Post by: P3D on January 28, 2009, 12:54:51 AM
IMO you should sell to NPCs - Mughal, Firanj or the Ottomans should be willing to buy, and they have no chance to get a new ship anyways. 5 year service then guaranteed. But I cannot make an offer instead of a mod.
Title: Re: SHIPS FOR SALE OR LEASE
Post by: Blooded on January 28, 2009, 01:17:42 AM
Tis true,

NPCs could certainly use them. My bid is still in though.   ;)
Title: Re: SHIPS FOR SALE OR LEASE
Post by: miketr on January 28, 2009, 06:25:37 AM
I will be doing the Ottoman budget they will pass on these ships; Bharat which I will do after that, I think would be very interested.

Poola makes an offer of $3 each armed for a total of $6.

Blooded as an FYI scrap value would be 1.3215 each.
Title: Re: SHIPS FOR SALE OR LEASE
Post by: Desertfox on January 28, 2009, 08:42:01 AM
New Zion makes an offer of $3 plus 1,000 tons of structural steel for the ships armed.
Title: Re: SHIPS FOR SALE OR LEASE
Post by: Carthaginian on January 28, 2009, 09:42:25 AM
Hmmm... sell to another monarchy and preserve tradition, or sell to the plucky little republic with a much better offer. To top it off, it's the Mohammedans against the Jews. The House of Lords, of course, favors the Ottomans; but the First Sea Lord is rabidly intent on gaining as much form the sale of the ships as possible- watch this space for roleplay opportunity.


We shall allow the bidding to continue in order to give the opportunity to allow for counter-bids from Russia and the Ottoman Empire. OoC, the Zionites are ahead.
Title: Re: SHIPS FOR SALE OR LEASE
Post by: Blooded on January 28, 2009, 10:47:03 AM
My total of 2.643 each was based on a scrap value of $1.3215 and 1.3215 BP. I gave a value of 100% for the BP(which is what Russia needs).

In my opinion BP should actually be worth 2x$ at least(as UNK this is how I sold it), but dealings with others since has shown that to not be the case(as Russia).

For what it is worth the Kings Turrets are new with 12"/45 cal guns, not the 12"/35 of the originals ( I spent alot on upgrading these before I learned of true ship values- though most counseled me against it- ooops , we live and we learn  ::) )
Title: Re: SHIPS FOR SALE OR LEASE
Post by: miketr on January 28, 2009, 10:51:39 AM
Blooded: Fair enough

Bharat and just about any NPC would be VERY interested in them as I noticed their updated state including modern fire control.  At any rate the Bharat offer of $6 stands
Title: Re: SHIPS FOR SALE OR LEASE
Post by: Carthaginian on January 28, 2009, 10:54:18 AM
Quote from: miketr on January 28, 2009, 10:51:39 AMBharat and just about any NPC would be VERY interested in them as I noticed their updated state including modern fire control.

If you'll also notice, it says "all state secrets will be removed unless negotiated separately"- this means that unless they also buy the fire control tech, the equipment in question is to be removed prior to sale.
Title: Re: SHIPS FOR SALE OR LEASE
Post by: miketr on January 28, 2009, 11:06:27 AM
First task is to win the ships... getting the FC is secondary.
Title: Re: SHIPS FOR SALE OR LEASE
Post by: Sachmle on January 28, 2009, 12:48:03 PM
The Reich offers $7 for both vessels, armed. The relevant 'state secrets' our not of interest to us, as We feel Our 'state secrets' are better than yours.
Title: Re: SHIPS FOR SALE OR LEASE
Post by: Carthaginian on January 28, 2009, 12:59:01 PM
Hmmm... it appears that someone serious has stepped in.
The House of Lords has little compunction about selling to the DKB. This offer is beginning to catch the attention of their age-deaf ears.
Title: Re: SHIPS FOR SALE OR LEASE
Post by: miketr on January 28, 2009, 01:16:21 PM
Bharat counters with $10 for both ships, armed and the fire control in place.

Title: Re: SHIPS FOR SALE OR LEASE
Post by: Carthaginian on January 28, 2009, 01:32:44 PM
The House of Lords and the First Sea Lord, after conferring over the apparently generous offer from Bharat, gently remind their representative that the fire control is considered a State Secret, and as such is only available to nations which have regular diplomatic relations with the UNK.

The UNK does not know the intentions of Bharat insofar as regards such sensitive equipment, and cannot allow such a politically unknown party to become privy to such a vital secret. The Fire Control Technology must- as indicated per terms of the sale- be considered a separate transaction and thus is subject to separate consideration by the House of Lords. Such consideration has been given, and the request for the fire control technology which might be reverse engineered from these ships is denied.
Title: Re: SHIPS FOR SALE OR LEASE
Post by: Desertfox on January 28, 2009, 03:49:09 PM
New Zion raises its bid to "$6 & 1k of steel"
Title: Re: SHIPS FOR SALE OR LEASE
Post by: Sachmle on January 28, 2009, 09:18:53 PM
The Reich will offer the aforementioned 7KM as well as an offer to post any Norman warship or merchant vessel at "preferred status" allowing them priority over any non-Brandenburg vessel at any Brandenburg port of call. This includes a fuel surcharge allowing Norman vessels to receive coal or oil at cost.
Title: Re: SHIPS FOR SALE OR LEASE
Post by: Carthaginian on January 28, 2009, 10:38:28 PM
The auction is officially closed.
The House of Lords has voted to accept the bid from the Deutscher Kaiserreich Brandenburg. We appreciate the bid offered.