Most likely I am going to lay down my 26 knot, 23,750 ton light AC's but I am considering building something else. Any thoughts? The AC is at the bottom as a comparison between the two.
Michael
QuoteBB-1912, Iberia Battleship laid down 1912
Displacement:
25,001 t light; 26,511 t standard; 28,286 t normal; 29,706 t full load
Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
600.00 ft / 600.00 ft x 100.00 ft x 27.50 ft (normal load)
182.88 m / 182.88 m x 30.48 m x 8.38 m
Armament:
10 - 12.99" / 330 mm guns (5x2 guns), 1,096.51lbs / 497.37kg shells, 1912 Model
Breech loading guns in turrets (on barbettes)
on centreline ends, majority aft, 2 raised mounts - superfiring
16 - 5.91" / 150 mm guns in single mounts, 102.98lbs / 46.71kg shells, 1912 Model
Breech loading guns in casemate mounts
on side, all amidships
4 guns in hull casemates - Limited use in heavy seas
8 - 2.95" / 75.0 mm guns in single mounts, 12.87lbs / 5.84kg shells, 1912 Model
Breech loading guns in deck mounts with hoists
on side, all amidships, all raised mounts - superfiring
8 - 1.97" / 50.0 mm guns in single mounts, 3.81lbs / 1.73kg shells, 1912 Model
Quick firing guns in deck mounts
on side, evenly spread, all raised mounts
Weight of broadside 12,746 lbs / 5,782 kg
Shells per gun, main battery: 130
4 - 20.0" / 508 mm submerged torpedo tubes
Armour:
- Belts: Width (max) Length (avg) Height (avg)
Main: 12.0" / 305 mm 400.00 ft / 121.92 m 16.00 ft / 4.88 m
Ends: 5.00" / 127 mm 200.00 ft / 60.96 m 16.00 ft / 4.88 m
Upper: 10.0" / 254 mm 400.00 ft / 121.92 m 8.00 ft / 2.44 m
Main Belt covers 103 % of normal length
- Torpedo Bulkhead:
1.50" / 38 mm 400.00 ft / 121.92 m 26.00 ft / 7.92 m
- Gun armour: Face (max) Other gunhouse (avg) Barbette/hoist (max)
Main: 12.0" / 305 mm 10.0" / 254 mm 12.0" / 305 mm
2nd: 4.00" / 102 mm - -
3rd: 1.00" / 25 mm - -
4th: 1.00" / 25 mm - -
- Armour deck: 2.50" / 64 mm, Conning tower: 18.00" / 457 mm
Machinery:
Coal and oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
Direct drive, 4 shafts, 38,000 shp / 28,348 Kw = 21.64 kts
Range 9,450nm at 10.00 kts
Bunker at max displacement = 3,195 tons (67% coal)
Complement:
1,089 - 1,417
Cost:
£2.439 million / $9.757 million
Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
Armament: 1,593 tons, 5.6 %
Armour: 11,297 tons, 39.9 %
- Belts: 5,359 tons, 18.9 %
- Torpedo bulkhead: 577 tons, 2.0 %
- Armament: 2,971 tons, 10.5 %
- Armour Deck: 2,030 tons, 7.2 %
- Conning Tower: 360 tons, 1.3 %
Machinery: 1,613 tons, 5.7 %
Hull, fittings & equipment: 10,097 tons, 35.7 %
Fuel, ammunition & stores: 3,285 tons, 11.6 %
Miscellaneous weights: 400 tons, 1.4 %
Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
38,613 lbs / 17,514 Kg = 35.2 x 13.0 " / 330 mm shells or 7.0 torpedoes
Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.07
Metacentric height 5.7 ft / 1.7 m
Roll period: 17.7 seconds
Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 70 %
- Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.50
Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1.25
Hull form characteristics:
Hull has a flush deck
Block coefficient: 0.600
Length to Beam Ratio: 6.00 : 1
'Natural speed' for length: 24.49 kts
Power going to wave formation at top speed: 45 %
Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 56
Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 0.00 degrees
Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
- Stem: 22.00 ft / 6.71 m
- Forecastle (20 %): 19.00 ft / 5.79 m
- Mid (50 %): 16.00 ft / 4.88 m
- Quarterdeck (15 %): 16.00 ft / 4.88 m
- Stern: 16.00 ft / 4.88 m
- Average freeboard: 17.29 ft / 5.27 m
Ship tends to be wet forward
Ship space, strength and comments:
Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 81.9 %
- Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 128.1 %
Waterplane Area: 43,883 Square feet or 4,077 Square metres
Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 102 %
Structure weight / hull surface area: 176 lbs/sq ft or 858 Kg/sq metre
Hull strength (Relative):
- Cross-sectional: 0.97
- Longitudinal: 1.25
- Overall: 1.00
Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is excellent
Room for accommodation and workspaces is excellent
Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
Good seaboat, rides out heavy weather easily
QuoteAC-1912d, Iberia Armored Cruiser laid down 1912
Displacement:
23,764 t light; 25,087 t standard; 26,835 t normal; 28,234 t full load
Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
650.00 ft / 650.00 ft x 93.00 ft x 27.50 ft (normal load)
198.12 m / 198.12 m x 28.35 m x 8.38 m
Armament:
8 - 12.99" / 330 mm guns (4x2 guns), 1,096.51lbs / 497.37kg shells, 1912 Model
Breech loading guns in turrets (on barbettes)
on centreline ends, evenly spread, 2 raised mounts - superfiring
16 - 5.91" / 150 mm guns in single mounts, 102.98lbs / 46.71kg shells, 1912 Model
Breech loading guns in casemate mounts
on side, all amidships
4 guns in hull casemates - Limited use in heavy seas
8 - 2.95" / 75.0 mm guns in single mounts, 12.87lbs / 5.84kg shells, 1912 Model
Breech loading guns in deck mounts with hoists
on side, all amidships, all raised mounts - superfiring
8 - 1.97" / 50.0 mm guns in single mounts, 3.81lbs / 1.73kg shells, 1912 Model
Quick firing guns in deck mounts
on side, evenly spread, all raised mounts
Weight of broadside 10,553 lbs / 4,787 kg
Shells per gun, main battery: 130
4 - 20.0" / 508 mm submerged torpedo tubes
Armour:
- Belts: Width (max) Length (avg) Height (avg)
Main: 10.0" / 254 mm 420.00 ft / 128.02 m 12.50 ft / 3.81 m
Ends: 4.00" / 102 mm 230.00 ft / 70.10 m 12.50 ft / 3.81 m
Upper: 4.00" / 102 mm 420.00 ft / 128.02 m 12.75 ft / 3.89 m
Main Belt covers 99 % of normal length
- Torpedo Bulkhead:
1.50" / 38 mm 420.00 ft / 128.02 m 24.32 ft / 7.41 m
- Gun armour: Face (max) Other gunhouse (avg) Barbette/hoist (max)
Main: 12.0" / 305 mm 10.0" / 254 mm 10.0" / 254 mm
2nd: 4.00" / 102 mm - -
3rd: 1.00" / 25 mm - -
4th: 1.00" / 25 mm - -
- Armour deck: 2.50" / 64 mm, Conning tower: 12.00" / 305 mm
Machinery:
Coal and oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
Direct drive, 4 shafts, 70,654 shp / 52,708 Kw = 26.00 kts
Range 9,500nm at 10.00 kts
Bunker at max displacement = 3,147 tons (67% coal)
Complement:
1,047 - 1,362
Cost:
£2.360 million / $9.439 million
Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
Armament: 1,319 tons, 4.9 %
Armour: 8,865 tons, 33.0 %
- Belts: 3,626 tons, 13.5 %
- Torpedo bulkhead: 567 tons, 2.1 %
- Armament: 2,462 tons, 9.2 %
- Armour Deck: 1,979 tons, 7.4 %
- Conning Tower: 232 tons, 0.9 %
Machinery: 3,000 tons, 11.2 %
Hull, fittings & equipment: 10,267 tons, 38.3 %
Fuel, ammunition & stores: 3,071 tons, 11.4 %
Miscellaneous weights: 313 tons, 1.2 %
Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
33,608 lbs / 15,244 Kg = 30.6 x 13.0 " / 330 mm shells or 5.2 torpedoes
Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.04
Metacentric height 4.8 ft / 1.5 m
Roll period: 17.8 seconds
Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 71 %
- Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.66
Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1.22
Hull form characteristics:
Hull has a flush deck
Block coefficient: 0.565
Length to Beam Ratio: 6.99 : 1
'Natural speed' for length: 25.50 kts
Power going to wave formation at top speed: 50 %
Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 58
Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 0.00 degrees
Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
- Stem: 26.00 ft / 7.92 m
- Forecastle (20 %): 24.00 ft / 7.32 m
- Mid (50 %): 19.00 ft / 5.79 m
- Quarterdeck (15 %): 19.00 ft / 5.79 m
- Stern: 19.00 ft / 5.79 m
- Average freeboard: 20.91 ft / 6.37 m
Ship tends to be wet forward
Ship space, strength and comments:
Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 99.0 %
- Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 156.9 %
Waterplane Area: 42,785 Square feet or 3,975 Square metres
Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 104 %
Structure weight / hull surface area: 171 lbs/sq ft or 835 Kg/sq metre
Hull strength (Relative):
- Cross-sectional: 0.96
- Longitudinal: 1.32
- Overall: 1.00
Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is adequate
Room for accommodation and workspaces is excellent
Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
Good seaboat, rides out heavy weather easily
Edit 1: Put up AC with extra armor belt length to cover mags
As Iberia does not have any other modern battleship, I prefer the AC with a few changes :
- make it bigger: displacement, deeper draught, beam and length
- stability is marginal
- thicker than 1" armor, esp. on the barbettes
You have 10,000SHP margin to play with.
If you want a BB, I'd try to make it smaller (8x13" on ~18000t) and build two.
As an FYI Iberia would build two of whichever desing is the winner. More detailed responce later.
Michael
Well, since the BC will go *BOOM* because of the insufficient armor coverage, I'd go with the BB.
I'd up armor the AC, specifically so it covers the mags/engineering spaces. Of course since the BB is only 1.75BP more, and at 21+ knots still pretty quick for a 25k BB in 1912.
Depends on what purpose the vessel will have and what operating area it is expected to patrol.
That said, both ships are quite servicable. I might try to go for a middle ground vessel that has the 330mmm cannons and maybe 23 to 24 knots speed and then start to average the fleet speed based on that vessel. They will be faster than most line battleships and no too much slower than the battlecruisers of the world at this time to allow the BCs a viable speed advantage.
Also armored enough to take long range hits from its own main battery. In case it does have to engage battlecruisers and slower battleships at range.
A 23-24kts ship with 10x13" and 13" armor would be 22-23000t.
I am considering a BB design because I have no modern BB's and it is a need but I have lots of needs.
Fast BB Concept... I think its a little large with only eight 13" guns. Sooo... Lets try for ten on the same displacement and speed, but it has most of the complaints of the 23,750 ton design. Just larger and 20% more firepower.
Michael
QuoteAC-1912e, Iberia Armored Cruiser laid down 1912
Displacement:
27,500 t light; 28,902 t standard; 30,814 t normal; 32,344 t full load
Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
665.00 ft / 665.00 ft x 100.00 ft x 28.00 ft (normal load)
202.69 m / 202.69 m x 30.48 m x 8.53 m
Armament:
8 - 12.99" / 330 mm guns (4x2 guns), 1,096.51lbs / 497.37kg shells, 1912 Model
Breech loading guns in turrets (on barbettes)
on centreline ends, evenly spread, 2 raised mounts - superfiring
16 - 5.91" / 150 mm guns in single mounts, 102.98lbs / 46.71kg shells, 1912 Model
Breech loading guns in casemate mounts
on side, all amidships
4 guns in hull casemates - Limited use in heavy seas
8 - 2.95" / 75.0 mm guns in single mounts, 12.87lbs / 5.84kg shells, 1912 Model
Breech loading guns in deck mounts with hoists
on side, all amidships, all raised mounts - superfiring
8 - 1.97" / 50.0 mm guns in single mounts, 3.81lbs / 1.73kg shells, 1912 Model
Quick firing guns in deck mounts
on side, evenly spread, all raised mounts
Weight of broadside 10,553 lbs / 4,787 kg
Shells per gun, main battery: 130
4 - 20.0" / 508 mm submerged torpedo tubes
Armour:
- Belts: Width (max) Length (avg) Height (avg)
Main: 13.0" / 330 mm 400.00 ft / 121.92 m 14.00 ft / 4.27 m
Ends: 4.00" / 102 mm 265.00 ft / 80.77 m 14.00 ft / 4.27 m
Upper: 6.00" / 152 mm 400.00 ft / 121.92 m 14.00 ft / 4.27 m
Main Belt covers 93 % of normal length
- Torpedo Bulkhead:
1.50" / 38 mm 40.00 ft / 12.19 m 26.14 ft / 7.97 m
- Gun armour: Face (max) Other gunhouse (avg) Barbette/hoist (max)
Main: 13.0" / 330 mm 10.0" / 254 mm 13.0" / 330 mm
2nd: 6.00" / 152 mm - -
3rd: 1.00" / 25 mm - -
4th: 1.00" / 25 mm - -
- Armour deck: 2.50" / 64 mm, Conning tower: 13.00" / 330 mm
Machinery:
Coal and oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
Direct drive, 4 shafts, 78,000 shp / 58,188 Kw = 26.05 kts
Range 9,500nm at 10.00 kts
Bunker at max displacement = 3,442 tons (67% coal)
Complement:
1,162 - 1,511
Cost:
£2.534 million / $10.137 million
Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
Armament: 1,319 tons, 4.3 %
Armour: 10,890 tons, 35.3 %
- Belts: 5,261 tons, 17.1 %
- Torpedo bulkhead: 58 tons, 0.2 %
- Armament: 3,090 tons, 10.0 %
- Armour Deck: 2,206 tons, 7.2 %
- Conning Tower: 275 tons, 0.9 %
Machinery: 3,312 tons, 10.7 %
Hull, fittings & equipment: 11,487 tons, 37.3 %
Fuel, ammunition & stores: 3,314 tons, 10.8 %
Miscellaneous weights: 492 tons, 1.6 %
Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
42,892 lbs / 19,455 Kg = 39.1 x 13.0 " / 330 mm shells or 5.3 torpedoes
Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.05
Metacentric height 5.5 ft / 1.7 m
Roll period: 17.9 seconds
Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 70 %
- Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.54
Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1.23
Hull form characteristics:
Hull has a flush deck
Block coefficient: 0.579
Length to Beam Ratio: 6.65 : 1
'Natural speed' for length: 25.79 kts
Power going to wave formation at top speed: 50 %
Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 57
Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 0.00 degrees
Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
- Stem: 27.00 ft / 8.23 m
- Forecastle (20 %): 24.00 ft / 7.32 m
- Mid (50 %): 21.00 ft / 6.40 m
- Quarterdeck (15 %): 21.00 ft / 6.40 m
- Stern: 21.00 ft / 6.40 m
- Average freeboard: 22.29 ft / 6.79 m
Ship tends to be wet forward
Ship space, strength and comments:
Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 89.6 %
- Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 169.6 %
Waterplane Area: 47,699 Square feet or 4,431 Square metres
Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 108 %
Structure weight / hull surface area: 174 lbs/sq ft or 852 Kg/sq metre
Hull strength (Relative):
- Cross-sectional: 0.96
- Longitudinal: 1.35
- Overall: 1.00
Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is adequate
Room for accommodation and workspaces is excellent
Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
Good seaboat, rides out heavy weather easily
QuoteAC-1912f, Iberia Armored Cruiser laid down 1912
Displacement:
27,500 t light; 29,064 t standard; 30,983 t normal; 32,518 t full load
Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
665.00 ft / 665.00 ft x 100.00 ft x 28.00 ft (normal load)
202.69 m / 202.69 m x 30.48 m x 8.53 m
Armament:
10 - 12.99" / 330 mm guns (5x2 guns), 1,096.51lbs / 497.37kg shells, 1912 Model
Breech loading guns in turrets (on barbettes)
on centreline ends, majority aft, 2 raised mounts - superfiring
16 - 5.91" / 150 mm guns in single mounts, 102.98lbs / 46.71kg shells, 1912 Model
Breech loading guns in casemate mounts
on side, all amidships
4 guns in hull casemates - Limited use in heavy seas
8 - 2.95" / 75.0 mm guns in single mounts, 12.87lbs / 5.84kg shells, 1912 Model
Breech loading guns in deck mounts with hoists
on side, all amidships, all raised mounts - superfiring
8 - 1.97" / 50.0 mm guns in single mounts, 3.81lbs / 1.73kg shells, 1912 Model
Quick firing guns in deck mounts
on side, evenly spread, all raised mounts
Weight of broadside 12,746 lbs / 5,782 kg
Shells per gun, main battery: 130
4 - 20.0" / 508 mm submerged torpedo tubes
Armour:
- Belts: Width (max) Length (avg) Height (avg)
Main: 11.0" / 279 mm 425.00 ft / 129.54 m 12.00 ft / 3.66 m
Ends: 4.00" / 102 mm 240.00 ft / 73.15 m 12.00 ft / 3.66 m
Upper: 4.00" / 102 mm 425.00 ft / 129.54 m 15.00 ft / 4.57 m
Main Belt covers 98 % of normal length
- Torpedo Bulkhead:
1.50" / 38 mm 425.00 ft / 129.54 m 26.14 ft / 7.97 m
- Gun armour: Face (max) Other gunhouse (avg) Barbette/hoist (max)
Main: 11.0" / 279 mm 10.0" / 254 mm 11.0" / 279 mm
2nd: 6.00" / 152 mm - -
3rd: 1.00" / 25 mm - -
4th: 1.00" / 25 mm - -
- Armour deck: 2.25" / 57 mm, Conning tower: 12.00" / 305 mm
Machinery:
Coal and oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
Direct drive, 4 shafts, 78,000 shp / 58,188 Kw = 26.02 kts
Range 9,500nm at 10.00 kts
Bunker at max displacement = 3,454 tons (67% coal)
Complement:
1,166 - 1,517
Cost:
£2.765 million / $11.058 million
Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
Armament: 1,593 tons, 5.1 %
Armour: 10,188 tons, 32.9 %
- Belts: 3,991 tons, 12.9 %
- Torpedo bulkhead: 617 tons, 2.0 %
- Armament: 3,334 tons, 10.8 %
- Armour Deck: 1,991 tons, 6.4 %
- Conning Tower: 255 tons, 0.8 %
Machinery: 3,312 tons, 10.7 %
Hull, fittings & equipment: 11,897 tons, 38.4 %
Fuel, ammunition & stores: 3,483 tons, 11.2 %
Miscellaneous weights: 510 tons, 1.6 %
Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
39,407 lbs / 17,875 Kg = 35.9 x 13.0 " / 330 mm shells or 5.9 torpedoes
Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.04
Metacentric height 5.4 ft / 1.7 m
Roll period: 18.1 seconds
Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 70 %
- Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.65
Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1.21
Hull form characteristics:
Hull has a flush deck
Block coefficient: 0.582
Length to Beam Ratio: 6.65 : 1
'Natural speed' for length: 25.79 kts
Power going to wave formation at top speed: 50 %
Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 58
Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 0.00 degrees
Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
- Stem: 27.00 ft / 8.23 m
- Forecastle (20 %): 24.00 ft / 7.32 m
- Mid (50 %): 21.00 ft / 6.40 m
- Quarterdeck (15 %): 21.00 ft / 6.40 m
- Stern: 21.00 ft / 6.40 m
- Average freeboard: 22.29 ft / 6.79 m
Ship tends to be wet forward
Ship space, strength and comments:
Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 97.7 %
- Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 169.5 %
Waterplane Area: 47,842 Square feet or 4,445 Square metres
Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 103 %
Structure weight / hull surface area: 180 lbs/sq ft or 880 Kg/sq metre
Hull strength (Relative):
- Cross-sectional: 0.96
- Longitudinal: 1.35
- Overall: 1.00
Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is adequate
Room for accommodation and workspaces is excellent
Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
Good seaboat, rides out heavy weather easily
Any comments?
Michael
Well, I think that Iberia would be better off building several smaller ships with smaller guns or slower speeds. As it is, it seems that that we're all trying to build the Hood at a time when battleships were barely breaking the 20,000 ton mark. Sure, she's got a high top speed and a good armament/armor scheme... but she's almost 30,000 tons light.
To me, that's too many eggs in one basket.
A ship that might be called upon to fight a war in the Med should be smaller and less painful to loose. I'd go with 3 ships of 20,000 tons rather than 2 ships of 30,000 tons.
^What he said. ;)
If I had to choose between the last 2 I'd go w/ the 1912f, more firepower, slightly less armor. More along RL lines, but Carth's right, with no modern BBs you need numbers, not size. Let the Maori build huge floating TB targets, build more mid size ships.
Battlecruisers don't need so many guns, being limited to these designs I'd prefer #1.
Undergunned, but if you want 26kts speed, she has to be. My previous comments still stand, I'd build smaller and slower ships.
I agree that the larger ships are too big, note the AC which I leaned towards is 4,000 tons light smaller, the problem is this; I don't have to worry about fighting a war in the Med but a war in the Atlantic or Caribbean or Mediterranean or Western Pacific or some combination of the above. The Pacific is my main worry because its so far away from my center of strength in Brazil/Iberia but other than Korpen and now Valles (he is also far away though its actually empty of player nations in the western Pacific. From a role playing point of view Japan and New Switzerland are something to worry about and relations between Iberia and the Netherlands are in the gutter. I have or will enough small cruisers, destroyers and soon subs for the Mediterranean if that is something to worry about. The Netherlands Armored Frigates are more what I am worried about in the short term.
The Netherlands worry demands 26 knots speed, enough firepower to defeat 9" armor belt but those ships guns are so heavy that I am not sure I can be well armored against them. To meet these needs I came up with the following design.
The reason for the 13" gun design was that I wanted to try for more firepower on about the same displacement. The problem with a pure BB design is unless I build atleast 4 of them what good does it do me? If I build something smaller what good does it do me if it can't run down / run away from other ships? Everything is pushing me towards a large cruiser in my mind.
Michael
QuoteAC-1912c, Iberia Armored Cruiser laid down 1912
Displacement:
23,500 t light; 24,812 t standard; 26,711 t normal; 28,230 t full load
Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
650.00 ft / 650.00 ft x 94.00 ft x 27.25 ft (normal load)
198.12 m / 198.12 m x 28.65 m x 8.31 m
Armament:
10 - 12.01" / 305 mm guns (5x2 guns), 865.70lbs / 392.67kg shells, 1912 Model
Breech loading guns in turrets (on barbettes)
on centreline ends, majority aft, 2 raised mounts - superfiring
16 - 5.91" / 150 mm guns in single mounts, 102.98lbs / 46.71kg shells, 1912 Model
Breech loading guns in casemate mounts
on side, all amidships
4 guns in hull casemates - Limited use in heavy seas
8 - 2.95" / 75.0 mm guns in single mounts, 12.87lbs / 5.84kg shells, 1912 Model
Breech loading guns in deck mounts with hoists
on side, all amidships, all raised mounts - superfiring
8 - 1.97" / 50.0 mm guns in single mounts, 3.81lbs / 1.73kg shells, 1912 Model
Quick firing guns in deck mounts
on side, evenly spread, all raised mounts
Weight of broadside 10,438 lbs / 4,735 kg
Shells per gun, main battery: 130
4 - 20.0" / 508 mm submerged torpedo tubes
Armour:
- Belts: Width (max) Length (avg) Height (avg)
Main: 10.0" / 254 mm 418.00 ft / 127.41 m 12.00 ft / 3.66 m
Ends: 4.00" / 102 mm 232.00 ft / 70.71 m 12.00 ft / 3.66 m
Upper: 4.00" / 102 mm 418.00 ft / 127.41 m 12.75 ft / 3.89 m
Main Belt covers 99 % of normal length
- Torpedo Bulkhead:
1.50" / 38 mm 418.00 ft / 127.41 m 24.32 ft / 7.41 m
- Gun armour: Face (max) Other gunhouse (avg) Barbette/hoist (max)
Main: 12.0" / 305 mm 10.0" / 254 mm 10.0" / 254 mm
2nd: 4.00" / 102 mm - -
3rd: 1.00" / 25 mm - -
4th: 1.00" / 25 mm - -
- Armour deck: 2.00" / 51 mm, Conning tower: 12.00" / 305 mm
Machinery:
Coal and oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
Direct drive, 4 shafts, 70,500 shp / 52,593 Kw = 26.00 kts
Range 10,410nm at 10.00 kts
Bunker at max displacement = 3,418 tons (67% coal)
Complement:
1,044 - 1,358
Cost:
£2.338 million / $9.350 million
Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
Armament: 1,305 tons, 4.9 %
Armour: 8,657 tons, 32.4 %
- Belts: 3,513 tons, 13.2 %
- Torpedo bulkhead: 564 tons, 2.1 %
- Armament: 2,754 tons, 10.3 %
- Armour Deck: 1,595 tons, 6.0 %
- Conning Tower: 231 tons, 0.9 %
Machinery: 2,993 tons, 11.2 %
Hull, fittings & equipment: 10,165 tons, 38.1 %
Fuel, ammunition & stores: 3,211 tons, 12.0 %
Miscellaneous weights: 380 tons, 1.4 %
Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
33,682 lbs / 15,278 Kg = 38.9 x 12.0 " / 305 mm shells or 5.2 torpedoes
Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.04
Metacentric height 4.9 ft / 1.5 m
Roll period: 17.7 seconds
Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 70 %
- Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.62
Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1.21
Hull form characteristics:
Hull has a flush deck
Block coefficient: 0.562
Length to Beam Ratio: 6.91 : 1
'Natural speed' for length: 25.50 kts
Power going to wave formation at top speed: 50 %
Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 58
Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 0.00 degrees
Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
- Stem: 27.00 ft / 8.23 m
- Forecastle (20 %): 24.00 ft / 7.32 m
- Mid (50 %): 19.00 ft / 5.79 m
- Quarterdeck (15 %): 19.00 ft / 5.79 m
- Stern: 19.00 ft / 5.79 m
- Average freeboard: 20.99 ft / 6.40 m
Ship tends to be wet forward
Ship space, strength and comments:
Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 98.8 %
- Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 158.5 %
Waterplane Area: 43,104 Square feet or 4,004 Square metres
Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 105 %
Structure weight / hull surface area: 169 lbs/sq ft or 825 Kg/sq metre
Hull strength (Relative):
- Cross-sectional: 0.97
- Longitudinal: 1.29
- Overall: 1.00
Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is adequate
Room for accommodation and workspaces is excellent
Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
Good seaboat, rides out heavy weather easily
Michael
If 12", I'd have 4T2 and push speed to the limits.
Otherwise go with the 8x13" one. But 55000t would give three decent small BB.
Here is my question... Define Decent? We are talking about 18,000 tons a ship, soo... 12" or 13" guns (4 or 5 twins), OK armor and about 21 knots speed I figure but people are building 14" gunned warships. Is there a hole in my logic that I laid out for the AC's?
As to a 4 twin 12" at 27 knots looks possible but would require massive fine tuning of the hull to achieve. I am not sure I want to ditch 20% of the firepower for 1 knot of speed.
Michael
There are more cruisers with 27-28kts around than with 26. I have a 8x13.5" design with 12" armor and 27kts (although full oil firing) with realistic BC.
You can get 27kts easily with 8x13", even if only B is superfiring., on a 715'x90'x30 or so hull.
Like this:
Enter ship name, Enter country Enter ship type laid down 1912
Displacement:
25,895 t light; 27,076 t standard; 29,036 t normal; 30,604 t full load
Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
717.00 ft / 717.00 ft x 90.00 ft x 30.00 ft (normal load)
218.54 m / 218.54 m x 27.43 m x 9.14 m
Armament:
8 - 13.00" / 330 mm guns (4x2 guns), 1,098.50lbs / 498.27kg shells, 1912 Model
Breech loading guns in turrets (on barbettes)
on centreline ends, evenly spread, 1 raised mount - superfiring
16 - 6.00" / 152 mm guns in single mounts, 108.00lbs / 48.99kg shells, 1912 Model
Breech loading guns in casemate mounts
on side, all amidships
Weight of broadside 10,516 lbs / 4,770 kg
Shells per gun, main battery: 100
2 - 21.0" / 533.4 mm submerged torpedo tubes
Armour:
- Belts: Width (max) Length (avg) Height (avg)
Main: 12.0" / 305 mm 452.00 ft / 137.77 m 14.00 ft / 4.27 m
Ends: 4.00" / 102 mm 265.00 ft / 80.77 m 14.00 ft / 4.27 m
Upper: 4.00" / 102 mm 452.00 ft / 137.77 m 14.00 ft / 4.27 m
Main Belt covers 97 % of normal length
- Torpedo Bulkhead:
1.50" / 38 mm 452.00 ft / 137.77 m 30.00 ft / 9.14 m
- Gun armour: Face (max) Other gunhouse (avg) Barbette/hoist (max)
Main: 13.0" / 330 mm 7.00" / 178 mm 12.0" / 305 mm
2nd: 4.00" / 102 mm - -
- Armour deck: 2.50" / 64 mm, Conning tower: 12.00" / 305 mm
Machinery:
Coal and oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
Direct drive, 4 shafts, 80,528 shp / 60,074 Kw = 27.00 kts
Range 10,000nm at 10.00 kts
Bunker at max displacement = 3,528 tons (67% coal)
Complement:
1,111 - 1,445
Cost:
£2.489 million / $9.957 million
Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
Armament: 1,315 tons, 4.5 %
Armour: 10,216 tons, 35.2 %
- Belts: 4,883 tons, 16.8 %
- Torpedo bulkhead: 753 tons, 2.6 %
- Armament: 2,301 tons, 7.9 %
- Armour Deck: 2,035 tons, 7.0 %
- Conning Tower: 244 tons, 0.8 %
Machinery: 3,419 tons, 11.8 %
Hull, fittings & equipment: 10,546 tons, 36.3 %
Fuel, ammunition & stores: 3,141 tons, 10.8 %
Miscellaneous weights: 400 tons, 1.4 %
Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
36,850 lbs / 16,715 Kg = 33.5 x 13.0 " / 330 mm shells or 5.5 torpedoes
Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.11
Metacentric height 5.2 ft / 1.6 m
Roll period: 16.6 seconds
Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 62 %
- Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.54
Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1.23
Hull form characteristics:
Hull has a flush deck
Block coefficient: 0.525
Length to Beam Ratio: 7.97 : 1
'Natural speed' for length: 26.78 kts
Power going to wave formation at top speed: 47 %
Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 50
Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 0.00 degrees
Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
- Stem: 29.45 ft / 8.98 m
- Forecastle (20 %): 18.74 ft / 5.71 m
- Mid (50 %): 18.74 ft / 5.71 m
- Quarterdeck (15 %): 18.74 ft / 5.71 m
- Stern: 18.74 ft / 5.71 m
- Average freeboard: 19.60 ft / 5.97 m
Ship space, strength and comments:
Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 96.7 %
- Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 141.3 %
Waterplane Area: 43,994 Square feet or 4,087 Square metres
Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 104 %
Structure weight / hull surface area: 166 lbs/sq ft or 809 Kg/sq metre
Hull strength (Relative):
- Cross-sectional: 0.99
- Longitudinal: 1.14
- Overall: 1.00
Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is adequate
Room for accommodation and workspaces is excellent
Good seaboat, rides out heavy weather easily
Quote from: P3D on March 05, 2008, 02:33:12 PM
There are more cruisers with 27-28kts around than with 26. I have a 8x13.5" design with 12" armor and 27kts (although full oil firing) with realistic BC.
You can get 27kts easily with 8x13", even if only B is superfiring., on a 715'x90'x30 or so hull.
I am not worried about 18,000 ton BC's I have scene being considered with very narrow hulls and 7 to 8.5" armor belts. Yes they can catch my AC design but none of them really want to though. My design has more armor, thicker armor and a TDS that is worth something. I noticed the Dutch Design and Baltic Design, any else building large ships?
I feel that the 1 superfing designs with 4 turrets on the center line are gimics. I can't think of any historic design like that. Something just bothers me about these very long narrow designs; I can't help thinking that in a real fight with anything able to trade blows with them that their handling would go down the drain as they take on water.
Your design is also closer to 26,000 tons light we are again into monster country for ship size.
I am not trying to be negative, the feed back and suggestions are helpful. Right now I am looking for people to point out the flaws as whatever I build next is going to be a massive investment in time and resources and I want to get it right.
Michael
The problem you are facing, Mike, is that we're hitting a wall in 'cruiser' production. Ships are getting very large because people are wanting to build battle cruisers... but battle cruisers are inherently flawed concepts (as I've said before) because they cannot safely combat another battle cruiser. Ships with cruiser armor and battleship guns make great cruiser killers, but they can't combat another ship of their own type because they lack the armor to safely face the guns, and lack the speed to successfully escape them.
That's where you're hitting your problem.
You're trying to build a ship that has battleship guns, battle cruiser speed, and battleship armor- a 'fast battleship.' Problem is, though we are at a tech level where battle cruisers are becoming feasible, we are not yet at a point where a 'fast battleship' is feasible... at least not without building them to 'monstrous proportions.'
Any ship with battleship guns ATM is going to have to make one of three tradeoffs:
1.) speed for armor and firepower
2.) armor for speed and firepower
3.) firepower for speed and armor
In Nverse with no treaty in sight we will have a continuum of armored cruiser designs from 6x8" up to full-fledged fast battleships, everyone can pick his own from the spectrum.
Quote from: P3D on March 05, 2008, 04:50:51 PM
In Nverse with no treaty in sight we will have a continuum of armored cruiser designs from 6x8" up to full-fledged fast battleships, everyone can pick his own from the spectrum.
Yes, but the tendency of humanity is to want the biggest and best of everything.
This is pushing the 'cruiser' out of existence and pulling us straight into development of the 'fast battleship' 20 years too early at least. The 'armored cruiser' and by extension, the 'heavy cruiser' is an outdated concept in our world... part of why I'm yet to build one.
Of the original designs, I rather like BB-1912, though I don't think that anything of the tonnage of the other designs really deserves the name 'cruiser'. 15k tons, tops.
That said, I recently had the interesting realization that the design spec for my Point Cruisers is... very similar to a battlecruiser, really. They carry heavier armor and armament than any ordinary cruiser and are designed from the ground up with the ideal of being able to slaughter such. Given that they're armored vs battleship guns (or, rather, than the new-construction ones will be) and small enough to field in superior numbers, I'm starting to wonder if they might not be a far better investment than I realized when I started trying to fit them into my doctrine.
Only 10 years too early if you consider Kaga and G3, and less with Hood, Ersatz Yorck and Caracciolo taken into account.
But yes, some navies will lack the number of middleweight cruisers, and a ship can be only in one place. Not the CSA, though.
QuoteAC-1912c2, Iberia Armored Cruiser laid down 1912
Displacement:
23,500 t light; 24,517 t standard; 26,418 t normal; 27,939 t full load
Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
650.00 ft / 650.00 ft x 94.00 ft x 27.25 ft (normal load)
198.12 m / 198.12 m x 28.65 m x 8.31 m
Armament:
8 - 12.01" / 305 mm guns (4x2 guns), 865.70lbs / 392.67kg shells, 1912 Model
Breech loading guns in turrets (on barbettes)
on centreline ends, evenly spread, 2 raised mounts - superfiring
14 - 5.91" / 150 mm guns in single mounts, 102.98lbs / 46.71kg shells, 1912 Model
Breech loading guns in casemate mounts
on side, all amidships
8 - 2.95" / 75.0 mm guns in single mounts, 12.87lbs / 5.84kg shells, 1912 Model
Breech loading guns in deck mounts with hoists
on side, all amidships, all raised mounts - superfiring
8 - 1.97" / 50.0 mm guns in single mounts, 3.81lbs / 1.73kg shells, 1912 Model
Quick firing guns in deck mounts
on side, evenly spread, all raised mounts
Weight of broadside 8,501 lbs / 3,856 kg
Shells per gun, main battery: 100
4 - 20.0" / 508 mm submerged torpedo tubes
Armour:
- Belts: Width (max) Length (avg) Height (avg)
Main: 12.0" / 305 mm 410.00 ft / 124.97 m 12.00 ft / 3.66 m
Ends: 4.00" / 102 mm 240.00 ft / 73.15 m 12.00 ft / 3.66 m
Upper: 4.00" / 102 mm 410.00 ft / 124.97 m 14.00 ft / 4.27 m
Main Belt covers 97 % of normal length
- Torpedo Bulkhead:
1.50" / 38 mm 410.00 ft / 124.97 m 24.32 ft / 7.41 m
- Gun armour: Face (max) Other gunhouse (avg) Barbette/hoist (max)
Main: 12.0" / 305 mm 8.00" / 203 mm 12.0" / 305 mm
2nd: 4.00" / 102 mm - -
3rd: 1.00" / 25 mm - -
4th: 1.00" / 25 mm - -
- Armour deck: 2.00" / 51 mm, Conning tower: 12.00" / 305 mm
Machinery:
Coal and oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
Direct drive, 4 shafts, 80,000 shp / 59,680 Kw = 26.91 kts
Range 10,500nm at 10.00 kts
Bunker at max displacement = 3,422 tons (67% coal)
Complement:
1,035 - 1,346
Cost:
£2.191 million / $8.763 million
Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
Armament: 1,063 tons, 4.0 %
Armour: 8,789 tons, 33.3 %
- Belts: 3,997 tons, 15.1 %
- Torpedo bulkhead: 553 tons, 2.1 %
- Armament: 2,424 tons, 9.2 %
- Armour Deck: 1,586 tons, 6.0 %
- Conning Tower: 229 tons, 0.9 %
Machinery: 3,397 tons, 12.9 %
Hull, fittings & equipment: 9,952 tons, 37.7 %
Fuel, ammunition & stores: 2,918 tons, 11.0 %
Miscellaneous weights: 300 tons, 1.1 %
Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
36,424 lbs / 16,522 Kg = 42.1 x 12.0 " / 305 mm shells or 5.5 torpedoes
Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.11
Metacentric height 5.6 ft / 1.7 m
Roll period: 16.7 seconds
Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 60 %
- Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.48
Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1.20
Hull form characteristics:
Hull has a flush deck
Block coefficient: 0.555
Length to Beam Ratio: 6.91 : 1
'Natural speed' for length: 25.50 kts
Power going to wave formation at top speed: 52 %
Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 50
Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 0.00 degrees
Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
- Stem: 27.00 ft / 8.23 m
- Forecastle (20 %): 24.00 ft / 7.32 m
- Mid (50 %): 20.50 ft / 6.25 m
- Quarterdeck (15 %): 20.50 ft / 6.25 m
- Stern: 20.50 ft / 6.25 m
- Average freeboard: 21.97 ft / 6.69 m
Ship tends to be wet forward
Ship space, strength and comments:
Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 96.2 %
- Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 168.1 %
Waterplane Area: 42,856 Square feet or 3,981 Square metres
Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 108 %
Structure weight / hull surface area: 165 lbs/sq ft or 804 Kg/sq metre
Hull strength (Relative):
- Cross-sectional: 0.96
- Longitudinal: 1.37
- Overall: 1.00
Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is adequate
Room for accommodation and workspaces is excellent
Good seaboat, rides out heavy weather easily
OK I have pushed the design as much as I can, later I will play with the draught a bit but I think this is about the best combination of armor, speed and firepower I can hope for at this time.
My view on cruisers is smaller cruisers and large cruisers. Anything in between the two will have the worst of both worlds I feel. Besides I have 6 cruisers in the 10,000 to 15,000 ton range already so I think I am covered there at least.
Michael
El Derfflingero!
Quote from: P3D on March 05, 2008, 05:24:47 PM
El Derfflingero!
A little light but yes.
Michael
Quote from: P3D on March 05, 2008, 05:07:53 PM
Only 10 years too early if you consider Kaga and G3, and less with Hood, Ersatz Yorck and Caracciolo taken into account.
But yes, some navies will lack the number of middleweight cruisers, and a ship can be only in one place. Not the CSA, though.
Every time says
Hood I hear "largest submarine afloat." :D
Hood was a flawed ship, if for nothing other than her handling. High seas rendered the ship virtually unlivable, and even in calm seas the quarterdeck was best visited with hip-waders, if at all. When it was realized that her already augmented armor was still insufficient, the problem was made worse when even more armor was bolted on and she lost another 2 feet of freeboard.
Considering that the
Hood's primary operating area was the North Atlantic, more attention should have been paid to her habitability... of course, this could have been remedied easily had she been made survivable rather than blisteringly fast to begin with. ;)
And no, the CSA won't be short of mid-sized cruisers as we really don't need any for our given situation. Those that I have will be scrapped and I'll concentrate on lighter scouts and a solid battleline to secure my territory.
Mike,
That one I like... a bit heavy, but good balance.
Build her.
Or not having her proposed rebuild postponed until war erupted...
Frankly, by 1941 Hood was old. While she was still a decent ship, quite large and fast even in 1941, she was still out of date and over 20 years old. While battleship technology advancvement was not quite as great between 1921 and 1941 as it was in the era we are dealing with, just imagine one of our ships, say Rohan's Eomer. She's from 1895 and has had one major refit (in 1901). She might get one more small refit to keep her in service until enough dreadnoughts and super-dreadnoughts get completed. But take her in 1916 against a historical modern super-dreadnought like say HMS Warspite. Eomer would get creamed even with a technology refit for modern fire control and the newest quality guns and shells of her type. At our age, even ten years is enough to get a ship sunk.
While Hood could muster a good fight, she happened to be unlucky in her last fight. One wonders if the ship was really all that flawed, or just her number was up. First hit knocked out her fire control, which is a tiny target high on the mast. Last hit was against some secondary (or even teriary) magazine that seems to have chain reacted through open hatches. Both seem more like bad luck than a design flaw.
Quote from: Ithekro on March 05, 2008, 07:19:54 PMWhile Hood could muster a good fight, she happened to be unlucky in her last fight. One wonders if the ship was really all that flawed, or just her number was up. First hit knocked out her fire control, which is a tiny target high on the mast. Last hit was against some secondary (or even teriary) magazine that seems to have chain reacted through open hatches. Both seem more like bad luck than a design flaw.
Well, IIRC, arrangement of secondary magazines was something that was a problem in a LOT of ships, not just British.
As for
Hood's design- whether for 1921 or 1941.
Her protection was inadequate when designed (a problem with a lot of British warships) and became worse as time went on. The bolt-on armor additions negatively impacted a bad design sea-keeping wise even more, making her the wettest capital ship in almost any navy. She handled poorly no matter how well she laid her guns, and here crews prayed for smooth water so they didn't drown in their racks- the midshipman's berths were known to flood regularly in poor weather.
That's my argument for 'bad design', not so much that she should have been able to face Bismark on even terms because they had the same main gun caliber.
OK this is the end of the road for a pure BB design.
As to HMS Hood, I have never been a fan of RN warships, their cordite track record of stability was way to low. Far too many RN Cruisers (armored and battle) and a few battleships had their last moments noted by a massive explosion. Hoods armor layout wasn't the greatest, being over weight was worse but her powder mags were a ticking time bomb. One theory, not a likely one mind you, had Hood destroyed by one of Prinz Eugen's 8" HE rounds setting off a fire that spread to the 4" mags and or torpedo's setting off the chain reaction explosion. Armor is important its even more important that your own munitions have a enough of a saftey margin that they don't kill you when any fire gets into the ammo system.
Michael
QuoteBB-1912b, Iberia Battleship laid down 1912
Displacement:
23,000 t light; 24,240 t standard; 25,660 t normal; 26,796 t full load
Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
550.00 ft / 550.00 ft x 93.00 ft x 27.00 ft (normal load)
167.64 m / 167.64 m x 28.35 m x 8.23 m
Armament:
10 - 12.99" / 330 mm guns (5x2 guns), 1,096.51lbs / 497.37kg shells, 1912 Model
Breech loading guns in turrets (on barbettes)
on centreline ends, majority forward, 2 raised mounts - superfiring
16 - 5.91" / 150 mm guns in single mounts, 102.98lbs / 46.71kg shells, 1912 Model
Breech loading guns in casemate mounts
on side, all amidships
8 - 2.95" / 75.0 mm guns in single mounts, 12.87lbs / 5.84kg shells, 1912 Model
Breech loading guns in deck mounts
on side, evenly spread, all raised mounts
8 - 1.97" / 50.0 mm guns in single mounts, 3.81lbs / 1.73kg shells, 1912 Model
Breech loading guns in deck mounts
on side, evenly spread, all raised mounts
Weight of broadside 12,746 lbs / 5,782 kg
Shells per gun, main battery: 100
4 - 20.0" / 508 mm submerged torpedo tubes
Armour:
- Belts: Width (max) Length (avg) Height (avg)
Main: 13.0" / 330 mm 350.00 ft / 106.68 m 12.00 ft / 3.66 m
Ends: 4.00" / 102 mm 200.00 ft / 60.96 m 12.00 ft / 3.66 m
Upper: 4.00" / 102 mm 350.00 ft / 106.68 m 13.00 ft / 3.96 m
Main Belt covers 98 % of normal length
- Torpedo Bulkhead:
1.50" / 38 mm 350.00 ft / 106.68 m 25.92 ft / 7.90 m
- Gun armour: Face (max) Other gunhouse (avg) Barbette/hoist (max)
Main: 13.0" / 330 mm 9.00" / 229 mm 13.0" / 330 mm
2nd: 4.00" / 102 mm - -
- Armour deck: 2.50" / 64 mm, Conning tower: 13.00" / 330 mm
Machinery:
Coal and oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
Direct drive, 3 shafts, 44,000 shp / 32,824 Kw = 22.56 kts
Range 8,000nm at 10.00 kts
Bunker at max displacement = 2,557 tons (67% coal)
Complement:
1,013 - 1,317
Cost:
£2.405 million / $9.620 million
Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
Armament: 1,593 tons, 6.2 %
Armour: 9,480 tons, 36.9 %
- Belts: 3,599 tons, 14.0 %
- Torpedo bulkhead: 503 tons, 2.0 %
- Armament: 3,321 tons, 12.9 %
- Armour Deck: 1,813 tons, 7.1 %
- Conning Tower: 244 tons, 0.9 %
Machinery: 1,868 tons, 7.3 %
Hull, fittings & equipment: 9,559 tons, 37.3 %
Fuel, ammunition & stores: 2,660 tons, 10.4 %
Miscellaneous weights: 500 tons, 1.9 %
Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
33,131 lbs / 15,028 Kg = 30.2 x 13.0 " / 330 mm shells or 5.2 torpedoes
Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.09
Metacentric height 5.3 ft / 1.6 m
Roll period: 17.0 seconds
Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 50 %
- Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.66
Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1.22
Hull form characteristics:
Hull has a flush deck
Block coefficient: 0.650
Length to Beam Ratio: 5.91 : 1
'Natural speed' for length: 23.45 kts
Power going to wave formation at top speed: 51 %
Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 41
Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 0.00 degrees
Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
- Stem: 26.00 ft / 7.92 m
- Forecastle (20 %): 23.00 ft / 7.01 m
- Mid (50 %): 19.00 ft / 5.79 m
- Quarterdeck (15 %): 19.00 ft / 5.79 m
- Stern: 19.00 ft / 5.79 m
- Average freeboard: 20.64 ft / 6.29 m
Ship space, strength and comments:
Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 95.6 %
- Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 146.8 %
Waterplane Area: 39,195 Square feet or 3,641 Square metres
Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 97 %
Structure weight / hull surface area: 178 lbs/sq ft or 868 Kg/sq metre
Hull strength (Relative):
- Cross-sectional: 0.94
- Longitudinal: 1.63
- Overall: 1.00
Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is adequate
Room for accommodation and workspaces is excellent
Good seaboat, rides out heavy weather easily
Edit: Increased the turrets armor a bit and shortened the belt.
VERY nice, Mike.
You've got more firepower and better speed than I do on the same tonnage in my Oklahoma class. Excellent balance, good ship. Were Iberia looking for a good ship, I don't think they could build a better one.
Thanks Carthaginian for the comment. I am debating building both the AC and BB designs; two of each design.
The AC's would need 23.5 BP and the BB 23 BP. The BB is also small enough to fit in a type 2 slipway; a whole 7 feet to spare.
If I put 3 BP into each a half it would take them 4 years to finish the four of them BUT it would tie up my entire build strength for that time period. If I import the engines, I could shave half a year off the build schedule. Of course in 1915 I would then be faced with the problem of building two more BB's at once to create at least a single squadron of modern BB's. A nice thought but again to much to do and to little to do it with.
Michael