Iberian Update

[Kaiser Kirk]

1923 Iberian Summary

This should give folks an general idea of the capabilities of the Iberians,
and allows me to find out how large the 'original' navies are.

Colonial IC has been built by region
A couple BP have been built.

Land/Air/Dp/Fort points have been built.
Dock construction is undertaken in several prime colonial ports. 
Really I probably should have built even more,
but when churning out turn after turn, details get missed.


All ships were upgraded to 1918 FC in 1920.5 ish
The pre-1897 ships were scrapped early, lacking modern guns.
The pre 1900 ships were retained as reserves until more recently.
The pre1915 Sub series was retained until the 1920 sub tech was researched, they are now being scrapped.

Once the 1915 naval gun tech was researched, a new series of guns and mounts was researched to give any future player flexibilty

Capital Ships.
The two El Cids I believe the SS was posted quite some time ago. As I recall they were 35000ton BBs ,

The Leon & Leona 35000 ton placeholder battleships have been started. I did a quick SS of
35000t, 4T2 400L50, 340mm belt, 120mm deck, 25knots. As a placeholder it is subject to player revision.

The Amadis De Gaulas is named after a Chivarlous Spanish knight in tales. 
A placeholder of 9000 tons is used. The idea is Two-gun 210L50 turrets. There seems to be a player trend towards 'heavy cruiser' types, big enough to hunt 150mm cruisers without the sheer cost of a battlecruiser. This is meant as the Spanish effort and when several are built, the oldest Pre-dreads will be scrapped.


Aviation Ships.
An experimental seaplane carrier has been built.  A Placeholder 6000 tons was used. The Angel Apriel was the keeper of Birds, which seems appropriate.

Cruisers
12 of the previously posted Cabellero de La Mancha
6 built, 3 building of a 1920 Gabriella de Castilla – named for the first (known) sighter of Antartica. 6000t – This is a 155mm placeholder cruiser

Destroyers
42 G and H class 1500 ton DDs are built. These are placeholders and actual designs will have to be worked out later.

Minesweepers
The iberians had 0, I built 36 Aux sweepers.
The supplyships were also antiquated, so 10x 8000ton Roscinate class, previously posted have been built.

MTBs
I did not greatly expand the MTB fleet.
Many of the Iberian colonies aren't the best coastlines for MTBs.

Submarines
Darman wanted to be a  leader in Submarines.
A series of 1915 subs, 25 in total, were built while researching the 1920 tech,

I researched the 1920 slightly early, which is very expensive,
but as a result, at the beginning of 1923 there are 12 x 1000t and 24x 500t subs.

[Kaiser Kirk]

Iberian Place Holders

The point of the placeholders was to allow the build plan to move forward,
while providing the tonnage to make a reasonable warship.

For the short term, if there was not a previously posted design, then I contented myself with quick designs to make sure the concept could be done. i.e., can the Iberians manage a 'fast nevada' at that tonnage.  In some cases - like can a 1500ton DD be reasonable? Or a 6000ton cruiser with 155mm ?  The answer was...yes. No Sim was bothered with.

The long term expectation was that a design competition...this time with more firm rules and ranked choice outcome... would be used to determine the ships built.

But in the meantime we'd have an idea of what's floating out there.

El Cid                            - 35000 ton BB, 25kts 10x400L45 – this was the paid for one.
(or Lady of Arinteros) – 33000 ton BB, 23knts 10x400L45- I think this was the posted one

1921 Leon, Leona  - 35000 ton BB, 25knots  8x 400L50 – not posted.

1921 Amadis de Gaulis – 9000ton light AC,  8xT2 210L50, 130/35 B/D, 29kts not posted.

1915 Cabellero de LaMancha – 5300t cruiser, posted I think . 8xT1 155mm, 75/30 B/D, 30knots
1920 Gabriel de Castilla – 5400t cruiser NO SIM. Expected to be updated Cabellero.

1915 F-Class DD – 1000t Destroyer Leader, 4x100 6x18", 30kts, posted ?
1918 G-Class DD – 1500t DD, 1915 ASW,  NO SIM
1920  H-Class DD – 1500t DD, 1920 ASW, NO SIM

1917 Roscinate Fleet Supply Aux – 8000t, posted long ago
1917 MS Aux – 400t, posted long ago.  Likely the same as the Norse.

[The Rock Doctor]

Good to have these updates, thanks.

Looks like the ~40cm gun is the trendy way to go now.

[Kaiser Kirk]

Looks like the ~40cm gun is the trendy way to go now.

That as I recall is a result of the short term players starting new guns in the biggest size they could,
400 and 405 are just cleaner than 406.

But, since they were being researched, I planned ships for them.

Shame, I would have liked to see more 14-15" as well.

[Desertfox]

I have a bunch of 14" ships, but since everyone is going bigger, I have a 16" gun in the works as well.

[Kaiser Kirk]

Like Japan, Parthia is in that 14" range...well 14.4"/ 365.
Unfortunately 14.5" is 368.. guess I could have gone 370.
Byzantine is at 380mm/ 15", and Parthia's started the 390mm/15.35".
With the Muzzle energy limits on the gun sizes imposed by tech, the 16" has some tradeoffs esp with the 1910 tech.
They get better with the 1915 tech, and that's why I researched those 50 caliber successors to the 45 caliber the players did.

Had I "run" the Norse all the way through, I would have simply kept their 356mm you put on the Arizona redux.
But Khyrses started the 405 ... oh well. 
Since the Tigers were followed by the Arizona Redux, the next class had to be BCs, and had to be competitive
with Rome, so the Ullers wound up Huge.

Likewise I may have modeled the Iberians on the Romans and fielded 13.5/ 345mm ish guns,
and a range of 25knt x 13.5 " ships in the 25-28000t range.

[TacCovert4]

Yeah.  I originally had no intent to go to a 16in gun, but with Rome going 16in, I wound up in a situation demanding it.......so I'm developing one.  Overall, my intent with the Aztecs had been to stay smaller in gun caliber, 11in, 13.5in, etc.  But Ironclad Bay basically put paid to the 11in gun as anything to ever willingly build into a true battleship, so the 14in gun got into production immediately, and then fears of a 16in Roman line torching my 14in line drove the 16in build program

[Kaiser Kirk]

The 14 really is a pretty solid choice for a while.

For one thing, do you have any idea how big a ship has to be if you put 5T4 16" on it?
My 365L45 choice was in part due to being able to keep the 20gun vessels down to just 'v. large'
vs 'mammoth'.

As I recall, the 11s had real issues with your then Gun Tech and the associated AP shells.
So you needed to be at close range to punch through the Romans.
They had both bigger guns and thicker armor, but your tactical set up meant their
leading edge was within range you were starting to punch into them, but their weight really told.

A lot depends on gun tech level - that ME vs bore size and shell size.
The gun tech ALSO effects which penetration numbers you're using - is it AP...APC...Improved APC...

The bigger guns matter more at range due to the deck pen, but even there it's odd.
The 16/45s of the SoDaks were better against decks than the 16/50 of the Iowas, as
the shell dived sooner.  Though I've read the Iowas were eventually fitted with dual charge options
and tables, so they could lob a reduced charge shell.  The USN fire control system late war was
Top Notch.