Austria-Hungary

[KWorld]

An initial set-up for Austria-Hungary.  As historical, a large emphasis is put on fortifications.

[Walter]

Looking at the start up, You have Trieste, Trento and Innsbruck on your list, but you gave away those cities to Italy when you marked the Venice area orange. ;)

[Walter]

Looking at a map I made which I kinda based on the map you made but a bit clearer, it looks like the eastern border runs from Opatija NNE with a slight curve to the NNW first. It looks like the border goes east past Klagenfurt before turning to the NW to Tamsweg. There is a downward notch at Bischofshofen and it finally connects with the OTL Austria-German border NNE of Saarfelden.

[KWorld]

The intent in Europe was to have basically historical borders (A-H without Trieste would have no ports worth the name), the high-level map is more for showing the unclaimed (by major powers) parts of the world than the long-claimed and well known parts.

[Walter]

Never got the impression that that was the intent. Considering that you use 140 BP and $700 for the A-H startup instead of 200 BP and $1000, it would make more sense if A-H did not have those bits. ::)

... also, considering that you made Tunisia Italian Orange as well as the level that Italy is at, it would seems very likely that Malta would be Italian...

... though I'd rather have my chocolate factories in the north. :)

[KWorld]

Malta's not going to make much difference as far as anyone's production goes.  Just assume that Italy's much more industrialized than historical.

[Darman]

Malta's not going to make much difference as far as anyone's production goes.  Just assume that Italy's much more industrialized than historical.

I'm pretty sure Malta belongs to the RN....

[KWorld]

Malta's not going to make much difference as far as anyone's production goes.  Just assume that Italy's much more industrialized than historical.

I'm pretty sure Malta belongs to the RN....

We usually refer to the territories of the UK as belonging to the UK or GB, not the RN.  ;)

But yes, Malta's British at 12:01 am on Jan 1, 1870.  I refuse to speculate on the situation as of 12:02 am.    8)

[Darman]

Malta's not going to make much difference as far as anyone's production goes.  Just assume that Italy's much more industrialized than historical.

I'm pretty sure Malta belongs to the RN....

We usually refer to the territories of the UK as belonging to the UK or GB, not the RN.  ;)

But yes, Malta's British at 12:01 am on Jan 1, 1870.  I refuse to speculate on the situation as of 12:02 am.    8)

Oh you can speculate all you want.  I'm fairly confident I know what the situation will be then :D 

And no, Malta very definitely belongs to the RN, its the only thing keeping it part of the British Empire after all :D 

[Walter]

It makes more sense if the Italian territories would include Baden, Wurttemberg and Bavaria and no Tunisia than Italian territories including Tunisia and not Malta. It has nothing to do with production, and everything to do with the threat this location poses to movement between Italy and Tunisia if it is in the hands of another nation. If Malta is not Italian then Tunisia won't be Italian either.

[KWorld]

Can't say that I agree with that: as long as Italy and GB are friendly, there's no problem.  Everyone's friends with everyone else, right?  ;)


The reasons I made Tunisia Italian are a) proximity, b) the fact that there were large numbers of Italians already living there, and c) bulking up Italy.


Is Malta in British hands a threat to supply lines to and from Tunisia?  Absolutely.  The RN bases at Gibraltar, Malta, and in India are threats to the French supply lines to Algeria and French Indochina, and to the Dutch East Indies.  Etc.

[Walter]

a) proximity

Tunisia is like a nation on the other side of the world compared to Malta. It really makes more sense to go for Malta first and then Tunisia when you're going to apply the proximity logic. If Italy has Tunisia then it has Malta. If Italy does not have Malta then it does not have Tunisia. That is how I look at it.

Also if you were to keep Tunisia Italian, it tells me that Italy was unified before 1850 instead of during the 1860s. If Italy was unified during the 1850s or 60s, then I doubt that they would have any time to bother with something across the Mediterranean at this point, despite its proximity.

c) bulking up Italy

You can also give me my chocolate factories to do that. That way it is not just Italy becoming bulkier. My soldiers, too, will get bulkier with all those chocolates being added to their rations. ;D

... maybe I need some Bavarian Beer and Sausages as well... ;D

[KWorld]

Tunisia would be a recent addition, probably 1869 or so.  It's a very short jump from Pantelleria to Tunisa, and Pantelleria was, like Sicily, annexed to Italy in 1860.  Tunisia was an nominally independent state in the 1860s, not a possession of a major power like Malta.  And, historically, in 1869 Tunisia declared itself bankrupt; a Commission Financière Internationale was thereafter formed, whose representatives led by France included Italy and Britain. This commission then took control over the Tunisian economy.

Here, just switch France with Italy and et voila, Italy has economic control of Tunisia, from which it's a very short step to colonization with full control.

[Walter]

not a possession of a major power like Malta

Problem is that here the UK is not a major power but just a regular power, the same as the US, France, Italy, Japan, etc. UK is not a major power like it was OTL.

Here, just switch France with Italy and et voila, Italy has economic control of Tunisia, from which it's a very short step to colonization with full control.

... which would make a pre-1850 unification of Italy a lot more likely than the OTL 1860s one...

... good thing I used a different Royal Coat of Arms than the OTL one of the house of Savoy. :)


Going back to the spreadsheet... Originally you listed A-H on the same level as those nations, but the lower starting values used in the speadsheet suggests that you dropped it down a level...

[KWorld]

not a possession of a major power like Malta

Problem is that here the UK is not a major power but just a regular power, the same as the US, France, Italy, Japan, etc. UK is not a major power like it was OTL.

The UK is not the worlds only superpower here, unlike in OTL.  It's a major power amongst other major powers.  Of course, the UK historically was more in favor of France getting Tunisia than Italy, because that way no single power controlled both sides of the straights between Sicily and Tunisia and would be in a position to threaten it's connection with Suez.

Here, just switch France with Italy and et voila, Italy has economic control of Tunisia, from which it's a very short step to colonization with full control.

... which would make a pre-1850 unification of Italy a lot more likely than the OTL 1860s one...

... good thing I used a different Royal Coat of Arms than the OTL one of the house of Savoy. :)

An 1869 event has the effects of pushing back previous events?  Can't see it.

Going back to the spreadsheet... Originally you listed A-H on the same level as those nations, but the lower starting values used in the speadsheet suggests that you dropped it down a level...

Basically, the reasoning there is that the mod doesn't want to be responsible for 2 major powers, but A-H is too important to the European situation to leave undriven.