What are the Swiss?

[The Rock Doctor]

Notional, hypothetical, possible re-jigging of Swiss populaton for consideration and discussion and not to be taken as fait accompli:

Existing Swiss Stats:

Swiss Home Island (SHI):  16.2 million people, 42 IC, $58
Australia:  16.2 million people, 41 IC, $57
New Guinea:  1 million people, 0.5 IC, $1.1 (ought to be $0.6)
Alaska:  1 million people, 0.5 IC, $1.1 (ought to be $0.6)
Hawaii:  1 million people, 3 IC, $4
Total:  35.5 million, 87 IC

Proposed Swiss Stats:

SHI:  14 million people, 42 IC, $56
Australia:  14 million people, 42 IC, $56
New Guinea:  1 million people, 1 IC, $2
Alaska:  0.5 million people. 1.5 IC, $2
Hawaii:  1 million people, 4 IC, $5
Total:  30.5 million, 90.5 IC

Total $ remains constant at $121.  Fewer people, greater industrialization.  Hawaii's a bit over-industrialized, but this is consistent with being part of the corporate ACM state prior to Swiss annexation. 

[Desertfox]

Interesting, and I kind of like it!

Except for points 2 and 4, as NS uses those tactics against powerful established governments, not small disjointed people. I would suggest something more closely resembling the current relations with Siam and New Zion, with NS gradualy gaining influence and finnally getting Japan to join the Confederation, as with Taiwan and Hainan where their fear of the MK pushed them into joining NS.

If it is true that Australia "started" the war, there should be tension between Australia and SHI, as the SHI got dragged into something they (presumeably) did not want.

That's where the Allies failed. They tried to split of Australia, when they should have been working on NS proper, especially after Japan entered the war. Note that NS did want an excuse to fight the Austrians and Germans, it was Japan that NS did not want to fight. And had Japan not entered, NS had the strength to end the war on its terms.

[Ithekro]

The Swiss themselves seemed to be played as if they were Americans more than English (where as the Australian Normans are played sort of like Australians and English).  Thus the polices of the Swiss attempt to follow a more American approach to things.  That is not to say it is better at all than the English model (which was rather effective), just the Americans seemed to go for the "Free Trade" model of diplomacy as well as the "We'll pay you for that land you have...and if you don't we will upset you to the point were you do something foolish that will allow us to declare war on you, beat you, take your land...and they pay you for it like we wanted to in the first place" method.

[The Rock Doctor]

NS uses those tactics against powerful established governments, not small disjointed people.

I can believe that NS would prefer carrots over sticks, but I can't believe that all these disparate little places would agree that Confederation with the Swiss was preferable to whatever status quo they'd had previously.  

I think there would be times where the local ruler would agree that Confederation was best, and happily join.  But there would be other cases - especially with the various ethnic-Chinese states - where the traditional imperial rule from the mainland was normal, and the "wacky outsiders with their strange democratic/free enterprise notions" were a bit unnerving.  In those scenarios, I would expect the Swiss to "save them from themselves" and use raj-like tactics to ensure the local guy-in-charge was somebody who saw things the same way the Swiss did.

I think the Swiss would evolve from a legitimate "do-gooders" into self-justifying expanionists.  After all, a defensive Confederation is better able to defend itself if it is larger.

Regardless, let me ask this:  if Japan voluntarily joins the Confederation, why would a sizeable ethnic Swiss population subsequently be established in Japan?  The locals would presumeably want to keep maximum control of their own political, business, culture and military affairs.  Why would they want a whole bunch of outsiders coming in and taking all the jobs?

That's where the Allies failed. They tried to split of Australia, when they should have been working on NS proper, especially after Japan entered the war.

I won't disagree with you that it was not a successful diplomatic strategy.  It was, however, the better military/logistical move.

Note that NS did want an excuse to fight the Austrians and Germans,

And it got its wish by recklessly ratcheting up the manageable Swiss/Dutch confrontation into a full-blown war.  

it was Japan that NS did not want to fight.

So why did Japan fight NS?  And why did NS fight back, instead of declining action?  The point's been made already, I'm sure, but tens of thousands of military people on both sides are going to treat any kind of immediate post-war alliance/friendship as a betrayal of what they shed sweat, blood, and tears for.

[Korpen]

I believe that after several years of near-continuous war, with significant territorial, material, and manpower losses, and at least two coup d'etats (during N2 - the Brownshirts coming in, and then being turfed again), there would be a growing war-weary pro-peace faction.

Especially considering that the Swiss have not gotten anything out of any of the wars other then losses and defeats, it seems likely that pro-war factions have lost most of their prestige.

[Desertfox]

Either we all hang together or we shall all hang separately. ;)

As for the ethnic-Chinese states, they where were the Ming Dynasty fled to much like OTL Taiwan. Last thing they want is rule from the mainland, and of all the past, present, or future holdings of NS, they are the most anti-MK.

And it got its wish by recklessly ratcheting up the manageable Swiss/Dutch confrontation into a full-blown war.

Well the war would have been over very quickly had the Austro-Germans satyed out. Instead they escalated the war and then where forced to bribe Japan.

So why did Japan fight NS?  And why did NS fight back, instead of declining action?

Japan was bribe AND forced to fight.

NS did fight but Swiss-Japanese military actions where relatively few and with few casualties. Only at Saipan where Japanese forces deliberatly targeted, and then only to relieve the island. The bulk of the effort was directed against the other Allies with Japan being pretty much ignored throught much of the war.

but tens of thousands of military people on both sides are going to treat any kind of immediate post-war alliance/friendship as a betrayal of what they shed sweat, blood, and tears for.

It has happened in real life. For example take Italy in WWII, the Boers after the Boer War, or the Austrians and Prussians.

Compared to other N-Verse anomalys such as the Franco-Norman Alliance, this is actually pretty logical.

[Ithekro]

And the Swiss have been at war with the MK since what 1900?  That is a long time, though most of it has been a Cold War, or internal fighting if I recall correctly.  The war with the MK from 1900 - about 1902 and then Civil War of sorts until 1904, then an almost war with Iberia in 1905, then relative calm for 1906 and then this war from 1907 to 1908.  You'd think the Swiss population would be burnt out and their military spent by now wouldn't you think?