Navalism 4 Map, Poll #2

[miketr]

Current vote total on the last poll has the following

Earth as we know it           -5 (31.3%)
Earth with some changes         -8 (50%)
Totally new world         -3 (18.8%)
Total Voters: 16

50% want earth but some changes, details of which unknown but its not a clear majority now 81.3% 11 of 16 want to use earth in some form.

This thread will attempt to address the nature of what changes people are looking for.

1) Some Change to Geography is adding or subtracting some elements to the globe but by and large its the world as we know it.

2) Some Change to History is attempting to use largely the historic nations.

3) Radically Different Geography, covers a wide area from things like additional continents, tilted / flipped earth setups, lowered sea levels, etc.

4) Radically Different History, Current world but we scrap the historic time line to support things like player nations in different locations.  About what I get the impression that P3D favors.

5) Use Earth as a base but change it and history, I assume that if we make ANY changes to geography there will be some changes to history but its a question of degrees.  Our current navalism game has fairly impressive changes to geography, some additional islands or enlarged ones, Australia and the Pacific Ocean got biggest changes with East African Rift Sea impressive in its own right.  We have lots of unhistoric setups in terms of nations.

[miketr]

I voted for #5.  I would like to add more islands and alter the geography a bit.  Mostly in terms of raising some things that are currently on the ocean floor.  Like Doggerbank in North Sea, Rockland Plateau in North Atlantic, adding some thing to the Pacific perhaps but not player controlled, a Pacific version of Africa.  Etc.  I am in favor of having P3D's idea of picking 3 locations or so and sticking the players there but these locations aren't directly connected to the major areas that will become colonies.   

[miketr]

When the time comes for a new game we will need the following done or nearly done.

1) Altered Map ready to go that shows new geography, mountains, rivers, deserts, etc.
2) Above map also in outline to allow for political control to be easily noted
3) Settle on what we are doing with the rules set
4) Set startup conditions.

[Borys]

1) Some Change to Geography is adding or subtracting some elements to the globe but by and large its the world as we know it.

2) Some Change to History is attempting to use largely the historic nations.

3) Radically Different Geography, covers a wide area from things like additional continents, tilted / flipped earth setups, lowered sea levels, etc.

4) Radically Different History, Current world but we scrap the historic time line to support things like player nations in different locations.  About what I get the impression that P3D favors.

5) Use Earth as a base but change it and history, I assume that if we make ANY changes to geography there will be some changes to history but its a question of degrees.  Our current navalism game has fairly impressive changes to geography, some additional islands or enlarged ones, Australia and the Pacific Ocean got biggest changes with East African Rift Sea impressive in its own right.  We have lots of unhistoric setups in terms of nations.

1&2

[TexanCowboy]

5). Why? Because some item's are things that are easily altered, and that make the game more interesting at little cost. Example: The Rift Valley. Although it was relatively easy to modify, and the geography is the same on the split area, it adds another area for conflicts and adds a secondary sealane, plus New Zion.

[Tanthalas]

I voted for 2, but realisticly I want both 1 and 2.

[TexanCowboy]

That's 5.

[Sachmle]

I voted #5 as well. However I'd not wish to see MASSIVE changes in history or geography. Quite honestly, while I like the Rift Sea idea, I HATE DKB/Maoria being in the middle of the Pacific w/ no effect on weather/current/etc.

[Valles]

I cast my formal vote for 3, because I'm entirely too afraid that 5 will turn into much of a repeat of the setting we have here, with history whose differences aren't significant beyond a specialist's interest, and clumsy hacking about to add new landmasses.

That is, my personal preference could be called 'three causing four', because I think they can both be done by picking a single elegant, very early divergence and then following it carefully rather than splashing different colors of paint and calling it done.

[Logi]

I voted for 4, but I would rather be along the lines of picking an early divergence and following it from there carefully than just something randomly picked out of thin air.

[Carthaginian]

I voted for 5.

I like opening the Rift Valley, could do with an 'Escape From LA' style 'Island of California', and wouldn't mind seeing new land areas in the Atlantic and Pacific (all those Atolls in Micronesia could map out a nice new continent).

Since my preferred area of operations will always be the North American continent, I have the following ideas for it.To really make things a bit interesting for North America specifically, we could do the following things:
1.) Lake Bonneville and/or other glacial lakes never dried up. At almost 1000' deep in places, they would make an interesting front for otherwise landlocked nations to have 'sea battles.'
http://geology.isu.edu/Digital_Geology_Idaho/Module14/Bonneville-Pleist-Lakes.gif
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lake_Lahontan
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lake_Bonneville
2.) The Great Lakes as we know the are 'modified' to allow for both for free travel (without need for locks) between at least most them and perhaps to encompass a 6th great lake, the prehistoric Lake Agassiz. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glacial_Lake_Agassiz This would, again, give another front for naval battles for nations that might only have one coastline.
3.) At least five major nations- six, counting Mexico or an analogue- on the continent... two competing for space on the Eastern Seaboard, one on the West Coast, and one in the Extreme North and one amidst the 'Lake Country' in the middle of the continent.

[Jefgte]

Change completly the history & the Nations

Important geographic changement for examples:
- Mediterranee completly open, Gibraltar Strait=300km.
- Sinai doesn't exist ; Mediterranee open
- Complete separation between North America & South America


Historical great Empires
- Chinese Empire
- Inca Empire
- Roman Empire
- Indian Empire
- Pharaon Empire
...


Jef

[TexanCowboy]

I'm totally in favor of Carth. Yes, me and Carth agree!

I would like to play two nations, if possible. The inland nation and a New Zion.

[miketr]

With respect to additional great lakes, etc.  I am fine with such changes but we need to consider the following.

#1) Do we care why things like Lake Agassiz and the uber Salt Lake dried up?  IE they were fed from glacial melt and once the ice age ended so did they.

#2) Who makes the call for what changes occur in terms of geography?

I have a suggestion with respect to #2.  We make things a bit of game so to speak.  We establish an order for people and then we go through that order X # of times.  When its a persons turn they can make a change to a location on the globe.  We come up with some limit to how much of a change this can be in terms of area.  Change can even be to undo some one else change.

Michael

[Carthaginian]

Mike, I believe that you have probably hit upon the best idea for re-making the world both 1.) fairly in regards to how it winds up and 2.) to suit our desired level of 'wierdness.' Everyone has a 'limit list' of how much you can change any one given thing- i.e. 'no island Europe, but disconnected Americas'- and we start picking. Anyone that makes a change that might be considered 'too wild' by some can be partially compensated for by a later decision, evening things out.

I even think this could work for countries as well. Let everyone pick a point for a random country (has to have existed at one time) and say whether or not they exist or not- if you're willing to integrate it into the agreed upon background and storyline it out, then you're good.