Shell weight effect on penetration

Started by P3D, October 11, 2007, 11:19:56 PM

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P3D

Just made some calculations on the effect of shell weight on penetration. Same gun (same muzzle energy) but different MV due to larger shell.

Observations:
Shell weight maximum is ~30% larger than SS default. The maximum I got with scaling th US 16" 2700lbs shell.

Taking everything into account, belt penetration is comparable within 20ky unless at very close ranges. The difference can be assumed to be negligible.
Deck penetration is a bit different. A 20% heavier projectile could get the same penetration at roughly 20% shorter range.
That's very good news for me, as I could lump all shell weights for a given gun (bore and barrel length) and shell type together and make calculations for a moderately heavy shell.
The first purpose of a warship is to remain afloat. Anon.
Below 40 degrees, there is no law. Below 50 degrees, there is no God. sailor's maxim on weather in the Southern seas

Borys

NEDS - Not Enough Deck Space for all those guns and torpedos;
Bambi must DIE!

P3D

Actually lighter shell->higher speed->lower trajectory->better accuracy.
The first purpose of a warship is to remain afloat. Anon.
Below 40 degrees, there is no law. Below 50 degrees, there is no God. sailor's maxim on weather in the Southern seas

Borys

heavier shell -> less affected by wind -> better accuracy
NEDS - Not Enough Deck Space for all those guns and torpedos;
Bambi must DIE!

P3D

Borys, you made me smile. We are speaking about half-ton projectiles here, not bullets from a pistol. The wind drift difference between a 850 and 1000lbs shells are minimal - the latter would have roughly 15% less drift, say, 17yards instead of 20 at 10ky at a 10kts lateral wind.

See Range Tables at the bottom, esp. columns 13 and 16.
The first purpose of a warship is to remain afloat. Anon.
Below 40 degrees, there is no law. Below 50 degrees, there is no God. sailor's maxim on weather in the Southern seas

Borys

Ahoj!
Every little bit counts :)

Those 3 yards might be the difference of hitting the magazines or the ice cream machine!

And just you wait for my 3000 pounders!

Borys

NEDS - Not Enough Deck Space for all those guns and torpedos;
Bambi must DIE!

P3D

If the guntables account for wind speed, don't you think correction factors can be applied regardless of shell weight? If the gunnery people think it is so important...:P
The first purpose of a warship is to remain afloat. Anon.
Below 40 degrees, there is no law. Below 50 degrees, there is no God. sailor's maxim on weather in the Southern seas

Borys

Ahoj!
And how do you know which way the wind is blowing 10 miles away from you?
:)

Borys
NEDS - Not Enough Deck Space for all those guns and torpedos;
Bambi must DIE!

Tanthalas

STAY AWAY from my soft serve Machines ><
"He either fears his fate too much,
Or his desserts are small,
Who dares not put it to the touch,
To win or lose it all!"

James Graham, 5th Earl of Montrose
1612 to 1650
Royalist General during the English Civil War

P3D

Quote from: Borys on November 23, 2007, 12:18:17 AM
Ahoj!
And how do you know which way the wind is blowing 10 miles away from you?
:)

Borys

Assume it is the same as where you are. My point is that any accuracy gained by smaller lateral drift is minimal compared to the effect of the lower trajectory.
The first purpose of a warship is to remain afloat. Anon.
Below 40 degrees, there is no law. Below 50 degrees, there is no God. sailor's maxim on weather in the Southern seas

Sachmle

I always figured the French had the ice cream machines on their ships.
"All treaties between great states cease to be binding when they come in conflict with the struggle for existence."
Otto von Bismarck

"Give me a woman who loves beer and I will conquer the world."
Kaiser Wilhelm

"If stupidity were painfull I would be deaf from all the screaming." Sam A. Grim

Borys

Ahoj!
Well, several navies thought otherwise :)
:)

Schmle - one US ship was saved by the ice cream machine deflecting the shell ...
Borys
NEDS - Not Enough Deck Space for all those guns and torpedos;
Bambi must DIE!

Sachmle

I scream, you scream, we all scream for Ice cream!!! ;D
"All treaties between great states cease to be binding when they come in conflict with the struggle for existence."
Otto von Bismarck

"Give me a woman who loves beer and I will conquer the world."
Kaiser Wilhelm

"If stupidity were painfull I would be deaf from all the screaming." Sam A. Grim

P3D

Quote from: Borys on November 23, 2007, 12:50:24 AM
Ahoj!
Well, several navies thought otherwise :)
I'd like to see a quote saying that the main reason behind the larger shell weight was smaller wind drift, as you allude. Anyways, the difference is so small that negligible in Navalism.
The first purpose of a warship is to remain afloat. Anon.
Below 40 degrees, there is no law. Below 50 degrees, there is no God. sailor's maxim on weather in the Southern seas

Korpen

Quote from: Borys on November 23, 2007, 12:50:24 AM
Ahoj!
Well, several navies thought otherwise :)
:)

I think this is related to muzzle velocity; a lighter shell spends less time in the barrel, so there is a larger risk of incomplete combustion.

A heavier shell at lower velocity also give a longer  barrel life.
Card-carrying member of the Battlecruiser Fan Club.